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Discussion Starter #1
Hi I just joined, thanks for letting me in (you may regret it). I recently got a nonrunning 2007 400. I have a pretty good mechanical and electrical backgound and have been working on vehicles for years. I have a copy of the factory manual as well as the proper tools and test equipment to diagnose most problems.
Now for my problem. The scooter is in very nice condition and always stored in doors with less than 12000 miles. The PO parked it last spring with a battery tender hooked up and it hasn't started since. When I did the basics, I realized that the sparkplug would only spark once when cranking the engine. If I cycle the ignition or kill button off and on, it will again only spark once when cranking the engine.
I've searched around the webb for similar concerns and found a few. Most threads have been posted with the concern, but no resolution is ever posted. The few that I've found, have said that they were related to a low battery charge, a corroded coil ground and an unknown after disconnecting and reconnecting ignition components.
I'm beginning to lean towards a faulty ECU, but would like to verify that before I go looking for one. They're no longer available and used ones are questionable. The manual gives no information for ECU testing.

This post has become pretty long and if you're still with me, thanks. So my questions are: Have you heard of this problem and if so what was the repair? Do you know of any test procedure for the ECU? Do you know what model year ECUs will fit?

Thanksfor following along.

...........Paul
 

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I would start with the simple things. Plug caps on the 400 can be problematic as they are a spring catch and can come off causing a poor connection. Check the coil resistance and the ignition lead. ECU' s are pretty robust. Battery needs to be in good order. New spark plug? Are there any fault codes showing or have you checked these. Could be a faulty cam position sensor or bad connection to the sensor. If you can list the things you have done we can tick off the list.
Welcome by the way lots of knowledge on here so keep asking questions but we are like computers you only get out what you put in so the more info you impart the better
 

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Maybe check the 'Tip Over' sensor.
 

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before i laid out any cash, i'd use jumper cables ,just to be sure
 

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Since apparently it was running just before he parked it for storage, I'm wondering what could have happened while the bike sat. You may want to remove all the tupperware and check all the wiring and cables for rodent damage. (I know you say indoors, but I assume that doesn't mean the living space and that critters would have access.) Also as mentioned, there may be corrosion in an electrical connector - possible that condensation or mouse pee could have caused a bad connection. Once you get all the trim off you will have pretty good access to "cycle" all the connectors (disconnect and reconnect) and just generally look around for other anomalies.

The plastic removal can be a PITA, look up Micbergsma videos on Youtube for excellent tutorials.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I would start with the simple things. Plug caps on the 400 can be problematic as they are a spring catch and can come off causing a poor connection. Check the coil resistance and the ignition lead. ECU' s are pretty robust. Battery needs to be in good order. New spark plug? Are there any fault codes showing or have you checked these. Could be a faulty cam position sensor or bad connection to the sensor. If you can list the things you have done we can tick off the list.
Welcome by the way lots of knowledge on here so keep asking questions but we are like computers you only get out what you put in so the more info you impart the better
I was going to list everything that I've done in the first post, but it was getting a little long. There were no trouble codes until I started testing/disconnecting things. I started with the simple things, moved to the more complicated tests, and then out of frustration, tried silly things.

Here's what I've done:
replaced spark plug
replaced coil
replaced spark plug cap
checked safety and fuel pump relays
checked fuel pump
checked CKP sensor output and resistance as per manual
by passed the start and kill buttons
disconnected ect,tps,stp, etc sensors
installed a redundant ground between battery and engine
replaced battery
checked/cleaned connections to ecu/ckp sensor
checked connections at the TO sensor

According to the manual, the ignition system include the CKP, ECT, and TPS as inputs and the coil/spark plug as outputs. All check out OK. The control to the coil is provided by the ECU after receiving the CKP signal. I can't figure out why there is only one spark if the CKP signal continues as long as the engine is cranking.

I'm not sure how the TOS operates and the manual offers no test, but it appears that it doesn't affect the ignition system, it shuts the fuel pump down if the bike falls.
I've probably missed a few things, but please don't be afraid to make suggestions, I'm willing to try anything.

thanks
............Paul
 

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If you don't mind me asking, I'm sure several of us are curious as to what non-running Burgmans are going for these days?
 

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I googled your condition and saw this: Car will not start- "I get spark while cranking for either 1 or 2 revolutions, then nothing until the ignition switch is turned off and on again.

I can start the car by rolling downhill and popping the clutch in first or reverse only, and once going can be made to run- but if the attempt doesn’t start the engine within one second, the ignition must again be cycled on and off."

"The problem might be with the ignition module. Ignition modules function in two modes. These are the start and run modes. When the ignition switch is turned to the start position, the ignition module allows full battery voltage to the coil. This insures that the engine starts with a hot spark when it’s cold and when the fuel mixture is rich. Once the engine starts, and the ignition switch moves to run position, the ignition module switches to the run mode. The ignition module then lowers the voltage to the coil because not as hot of a spark is required to keep the engine running. And it also allows the secondary ignition components last longer by not burning them up.

So it could be that the ignition module is failing during the start mode, but functions fine in the run mode. This would explain why you can’t get the engine to start. But you can get the engine to run by popping the clutch."

Since the Burgman does not have an ignition module it could be the ECM. Too bad you do not have a healthy one to swap out just to verify that might be the cause. This is just a wild guess on my part.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thanks for all the responses so far. As far as the storage of the bike before I got it, it was in very clean, dry, climate controlled space. The thought of rodents camping out in it crossed my mind and I was hoping to find the proverbial rats nest, mouse poop, or chewed wires, but it's clean. As it's been suggested, the plastic is a pita to remove, but I did it. I've got panels stacked all over the garage and more plastic push pins than I know what to do with.

In many ignition systems there are two circuits to energize the coil....the start and run. In older vehicles an inline resistor was used in the run circuit, some of you may remember the Chysler products of the sixties that would burn out at the worst times. When burned out, the engine would start and run as long as the key was held in the run position, but would die when released. I've attempted to eliminate this kind of thing by cranking the engine by energizing the starter solenoid directly and by passing the starter button.

I've been trying to logically understand what could have happened while it was in storage and contacted the PO to ask one question: Is it possible that the battery was jumped or charged with the leads crossed? His answer:" I don't think so, but its possible." I would love to swap out a known good module, but new ones are nla and I'm a little hesitant to try an ebay one.

Keep the ideas coming, one of them gotta work.

........Paul
 

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I would love to swap out a known good module, but new ones are nla and I'm a little hesitant to try an ebay one.

Keep the ideas coming, one of them gotta work.

........Paul
I’d send the EBay sellers a question on history of bike and why they are parting it out. Depending on their response I’d order one.
 

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JBeasty is parting out an 07 over in classifieds; you might want to ask if he has the ECM.
 

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JBeasty is parting out an 07 over in classifieds; you might want to ask if he has the ECM.
I thought the same thing and private messaged him with a description of this link. I didn't see it on his picture of the wiring harness. There are 16 Burgman 400 ECM's on Ebay also.

And I hate just throwing parts at vehicles hoping it will fix it. I have done that before!
 

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since it isn't showing a code, er, you did double check the jumper was in the right place? i'd be thinkin ecm, so jack it up ,remove windscreen bolts, pull bike out, push new bike under, bolt screen on. problem solved.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I’d send the EBay sellers a question on history of bike and why they are parting it out. Depending on their response I’d order one.
That looks like what I'm going to do. Although there's quite a few listed, I've narrowed it down to two. For some reason the factory parts catalog lists the one for the 07 as specific to that year only, but most ebay sellers say that all of them from 07-09 will work.

......Paul
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Have you thought about purchasing one of these Diagnostic OBD Tools to maybe get more information on whats going on. It would connect to the bike and your laptop. I thought of purchasing one.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Diagnostic-OBD-Tool-Fit-for-Motorcycles-Multi-Language-Diagnostic-Scanner/254271851299?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
I've considered buying one (there's a few others that seem to have more cables)but I have access to the Suzuki SDS tester and have found that the ignition system in the ECU doesn't supply any live data except for voltage input from the CKP. I've already been able to prove that out manually.

......Paul
 

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I was going to list everything that I've done in the first post, but it was getting a little long. There were no trouble codes until I started testing/disconnecting things. I started with the simple things, moved to the more complicated tests, and then out of frustration, tried silly things.

Here's what I've done:
replaced spark plug
replaced coil
replaced spark plug cap
checked safety and fuel pump relays
checked fuel pump
checked CKP sensor output and resistance as per manual
by passed the start and kill buttons
disconnected ect,tps,stp, etc sensors
installed a redundant ground between battery and engine
replaced battery
checked/cleaned connections to ecu/ckp sensor
checked connections at the TO sensor

According to the manual, the ignition system include the CKP, ECT, and TPS as inputs and the coil/spark plug as outputs. All check out OK. The control to the coil is provided by the ECU after receiving the CKP signal. I can't figure out why there is only one spark if the CKP signal continues as long as the engine is cranking.

I'm not sure how the TOS operates and the manual offers no test, but it appears that it doesn't affect the ignition system, it shuts the fuel pump down if the bike falls.
I've probably missed a few things, but please don't be afraid to make suggestions, I'm willing to try anything.

thanks
............Paul
So you have checked the Crank sensor have you checked the Cam shaft sensor? You would need to crank the engine for 10 seconds or more to show the FI light and see if there are any fault codes. You have been pretty thorough I will give you that. The Crank sensor may be dirty or contaminated can you clean it? One assumes it does the self check on the dash and the fuel pump primes etc when ignition on? If it was running ok before being put to bed in a cosy garage I cant see the ECM failing but stranger things have happened.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
So you have checked the Crank sensor have you checked the Cam shaft sensor? You would need to crank the engine for 10 seconds or more to show the FI light and see if there are any fault codes. You have been pretty thorough I will give you that. The Crank sensor may be dirty or contaminated can you clean it? One assumes it does the self check on the dash and the fuel pump primes etc when ignition on? If it was running ok before being put to bed in a cosy garage I cant see the ECM failing but stranger things have happened.
OK, now you got me, cam sensor?? I'm familiar with auto systems that have cam and crank sensors, but I don't see a cam sensor on this engine. Any idea where it is located?

I've considered a contaminated CKP, but it's located inside the rt engine case and I'd have to remove it to physically check it. I feel pretty confident that it's Ok due to the voltage output and resistance tests.

I'm beginning to believe that the PO may have damaged the ECU by hooking up the battery charger backwards.

.........Paul
 
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