War War and more War
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Perhaps they've all been covered up by the magnetic yellow ribbons saying, "Support our troops"?
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2,070 Posts
I'd like a sticker saying "Support Our Troops..Bring Them Home"
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11,296 Posts
This is a really difficult one isn't it?
Whatever you think about the merits of the latest action (to oust Sadam), that is no longer an item of debate. We are where we are and there is no going back. God knows it is an unholy mess, but as painful and costly (in lives and $$$) as it is, it would be irresponsible to walk away.
You could argue that we created this mess and now we have to clear it up.
Note the use of the term WE.
I do not expect people to agree with me - I offer my opinion only.
Whatever you think about the merits of the latest action (to oust Sadam), that is no longer an item of debate. We are where we are and there is no going back. God knows it is an unholy mess, but as painful and costly (in lives and $$$) as it is, it would be irresponsible to walk away.
You could argue that we created this mess and now we have to clear it up.
Note the use of the term WE.
I do not expect people to agree with me - I offer my opinion only.
I hope it doesn't run the same course as Vietnam, but it looks similiar:
We initiate a shooting war under what turns out to be a false premise (Gulf of Tonkin then, WMD now), proceed under a new justification (communist domino effect then, liberate Iraq now), things begin to go bad and it becomes irresponsible of us to walk away. Turns out we were part of the problem then, not part of the solution. I dearly hope that is not the case here.
God bless America, God bless our (and ALL coallition) troops, and may God have mercy on us all.
Peace.
We initiate a shooting war under what turns out to be a false premise (Gulf of Tonkin then, WMD now), proceed under a new justification (communist domino effect then, liberate Iraq now), things begin to go bad and it becomes irresponsible of us to walk away. Turns out we were part of the problem then, not part of the solution. I dearly hope that is not the case here.
God bless America, God bless our (and ALL coallition) troops, and may God have mercy on us all.
Peace.
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I have very strong opinions on this subject, but other than wishing _all_ Coalition troops the absolute best I'm not going to voice any of them. Why? Because this is a **** fine _scooter_ forum, where many friendships are being made on a daily basis, and this totally-unrelated and off-topic issue (like a handful of others) is so divisive that it can and will end friendships before they really begin.
No one is going to persuade anyone of anything here and now, vis-a-vis the war. There is no _point_ to discussing issues like Iraq, gun control, abortion, and the like in this sort of venue. It only makes for snarly ill-will.
I'd like to petition the admins to strike this whole thread from the record, and not allow the start of others like it.
No one is going to persuade anyone of anything here and now, vis-a-vis the war. There is no _point_ to discussing issues like Iraq, gun control, abortion, and the like in this sort of venue. It only makes for snarly ill-will.
I'd like to petition the admins to strike this whole thread from the record, and not allow the start of others like it.
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Hi LR
I respect your opinion and understand your motivation and intent.
However: The Cafe : A place to chat about anything.
We are all big enough and ugly enough to cope with different viewpoints AND we do not have flame wars on this forum.
The owner and moderators may well agree with you BUT I just wanted to put forward my view.
I respect your opinion and understand your motivation and intent.
However: The Cafe : A place to chat about anything.
We are all big enough and ugly enough to cope with different viewpoints AND we do not have flame wars on this forum.
The owner and moderators may well agree with you BUT I just wanted to put forward my view.
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466 Posts
Norm and all you Brits,
I want to thank you guys (The British people) for supporting this effort knowing that it comes with much suffering and hardship. If we get nothing else out of this effort we at least found out who are our friends around the world and who we can count on when we need help. Regardless how people feel about Iraq, I think most Americans can appreciate the close ties of your country and ours.
Thanx,
Russ
I want to thank you guys (The British people) for supporting this effort knowing that it comes with much suffering and hardship. If we get nothing else out of this effort we at least found out who are our friends around the world and who we can count on when we need help. Regardless how people feel about Iraq, I think most Americans can appreciate the close ties of your country and ours.
Thanx,
Russ
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1,002 Posts
Norman-
I understand and respect your stance as well. What does and does not constitute proper forum usage is in my opinion very much a multi-sided issue, with no true "right" answer. Or, perhaps, not even any really "good" answer.
If everyone were as easy to get along with as you, this kind of thing would never become an issue.
I understand and respect your stance as well. What does and does not constitute proper forum usage is in my opinion very much a multi-sided issue, with no true "right" answer. Or, perhaps, not even any really "good" answer.
If everyone were as easy to get along with as you, this kind of thing would never become an issue.
Hello Russ Schaefer-Palmdale
Hi Russ, I live about 45 minutes from you in Tehachapi, Ca.
As a Viet Vet, I wish you all the very best this year and many happy
hours on your Burggie. I do not own one yet. Considering a 650.
Let us all keep our troops in our prayers, and also a solution to this
problem and to bring our boys home (whichever country you are from).
This forum seems to have some REAL people here and some real
solutions to our common Burgie problems/challenges. May we continue
to be above the normal B.S. that life and governments impost on us.
Your Burgie friend in training,
Mike
Hi Russ, I live about 45 minutes from you in Tehachapi, Ca.
As a Viet Vet, I wish you all the very best this year and many happy
hours on your Burggie. I do not own one yet. Considering a 650.
Let us all keep our troops in our prayers, and also a solution to this
problem and to bring our boys home (whichever country you are from).
This forum seems to have some REAL people here and some real
solutions to our common Burgie problems/challenges. May we continue
to be above the normal B.S. that life and governments impost on us.
Your Burgie friend in training,
Mike
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2,070 Posts
I'm with Norm, in that I like to see folks voice their opinions and that we are all big enough to agree to disagree. In this case, I disagree with Norm, but the SCARY part is I agree with BLEEDER! :lol: :lol:
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105 Posts
Your myopia is overwhelming. What about the real facts.Bleeder said:
- Saddam Hussein contunually violated the surrender agreement he made from the Gulf War.
- Saddam Hussein actually USED chemical weapons.
- Saddam Hussein never accounted for the disposal of chemical and biological weapons he was known to have had. In other words, he could not prove he did not still have them.
- Saddam Hussein murdered over 500,00 people whose remains were found in mass graves throughout Iraq.
- Saddam Hussein's security force was known to have ties with terrorists.
I could add more but I don't want to bore you with reality.
The conflict in Iraq will only turn our like Vietnam if the mainstream press and "peace"activists have their way. Victory is the only option. Victory is the only path to peace.
Iraqi's have world news too and see how democracy works and doesn't work.
The more infighting that an Iraqi voter sees from the US/GB/Israel, the more
apprehension they may have participating in their own democracy.
The US has more WMD’s than all the little dictators the world tolerates now.
Islam is not as stupid as the US would like to portray it because Islam sees our weapons bunkers
on their TV’s.
We have taught the world to use WMD’s responsibly by emulating our judgment and behavior.
Really now, is “justifying” the stockpiles of WMD’s in the US but not in Islam proper judgment
and behavior?
10+ years of sanctions were well devised to drive Saddam toward irrational behavior and away
from Iraqi oil fields.
It is therefore no surprise that the almighty US military wouldn’t be caught dead
in Africa, defending “families” from machete wielding madmen!
The more infighting that an Iraqi voter sees from the US/GB/Israel, the more
apprehension they may have participating in their own democracy.
The US has more WMD’s than all the little dictators the world tolerates now.
Islam is not as stupid as the US would like to portray it because Islam sees our weapons bunkers
on their TV’s.
We have taught the world to use WMD’s responsibly by emulating our judgment and behavior.
Really now, is “justifying” the stockpiles of WMD’s in the US but not in Islam proper judgment
and behavior?
10+ years of sanctions were well devised to drive Saddam toward irrational behavior and away
from Iraqi oil fields.
It is therefore no surprise that the almighty US military wouldn’t be caught dead
in Africa, defending “families” from machete wielding madmen!
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11,296 Posts
Perleeeese - I do not think the Brits want to be associated with the current IsraeliArab marlarkey even though we are wrapped up in its history (from an Arab perspective as the cause celebre with Lord Palmerston's declaration).ajwood said:
The Israeli/Palestine conflict is a centre of gravity in discontent in the Arab street.
The US have (by deed) sided with Israel due to the strong lobby within the US, no doubt it will continue to do so. Brit sympathies are not naturally inclined towards Israel IMHO.
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1,402 Posts
I know that this can never be, (I suppose it's polly-anna-ish to even think it), because there will always be people out there that think they can have it all by using force etc., but wouldn't it be great if we all could live by one very simple rule.
Treat everyone else the same way you would like to be treated.
Better known as, do unto others.......
Simple!
Even if we ignored the other nine suggestions/commandments/guidelines, this could work.
It covers everything.:wink:
In a perfect world. Sigh..................
Treat everyone else the same way you would like to be treated.
Better known as, do unto others.......
Simple!
Even if we ignored the other nine suggestions/commandments/guidelines, this could work.
It covers everything.:wink:
In a perfect world. Sigh..................
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2,164 Posts
Sorry dero, i knew they were there, just did not mention them all, maby they dont let the peace protestors get away wit so much. Gov here is scard to lose votes, but we did have Bush visit Halifax to thank us for helping out during 911, I gess Nova Scotia was the best place to come for a visit when you come to Canada Wayne
Wayne1 - 20 of 25 Posts
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