[Craig]

I have been riding the Burgman 400 for about a month now and love it. It was purchased with the idea of in-town riding. Well as it turns out I also like hitting the open road. I think the 400 may be a little light for the higher speeds and have been looking to move up to the 650. Any help on how the two compare would be appreciated.

In addition my 400 is the 03 blue model, love the color. Since I am so close to the new model year does anyone know what color options the 05 will have? Will there be any other changes from the 03-04 models?

 

[Jim]

I did that last year, same story. We were out of motorcycling for about 25 years. and decided to get back into it, not knowing if we could still do it. We found we could a wanted to do more

I ride 2 up most of the time, higher speed. Big Difference. We just got back from a 2 day day road trip, and me and my wife were commenting what a job it would have been on the 400. Running steady @ 80 for and hr. or so with saddlebags, would have really taxed the 400. The tires are also bigger which makes for a better ride. Lastly I felt more comfortable running at 4,000 RPM @ 60 than 6,000 rpm. Cross winds are also less of an issue, as the 650 is much more stable (I feel).

There several post on this very subject about 6 months ago.

Here His a link that may help

http://burgmanusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=54

The 400 is a fine machine but for our use the 650 works better.

 

[roy_ryall]

Craig, I am about to make the full circle, 650 to 400 to 650. As far as the highway stability and added weight, I have I can not remember a time on the 400 when I felt unsafe due to the weight or stability at high highway speeds. You will gain some weight for high speed riding with the 650 but you will also gain the weight for pushing around and low speeds. Also, the drive train on the 650 makes it a lot more difficult to push around. So, I guess it depends on your around town to road trip ratio. Unless you are going to spend a lot more time on the highway than in town you may want to consider staying with the 400 for a while.

If you are riding a lot two up on the highway, like Jim, the 650 would work out better.

Another factor is your inseam. The 650 has a higher seat height. It bothers some people, others prefer to have their feet more planted when they stop.

Pushing the 650 around, the added weight at low speeds, and seat height are some of the reasons I wanted a 400 and traded my 650.

05s, no one knows yet. We should find out in a month or two. If you really want the same color blue as your '03 400, you can more than likely find the same color blue '03 650 around some where, if you are willing to pick it up or have it shipped.

Ideally I would keep the 400 for around town and weekend day rides (100 to 200 miles) and save my 650 only for long trips only. But, I cannot see having that much money in bikes. Maybe I can find a 150 to 250 cc scooter cheap for around town. I would like to have another Helix or a Reflex but they seem to too high for a second bike and my budget.

I am moving back to the 650 for the smooth drive train operation, long trips, and my personal hang up about been able to out perform or at least give a good showing with most bikes on the road.

While the 650 is a very nice all around bike. Like everything, it does a have some "less than ideal" aspects.

Finally, get the 650, if you are like me, you just want another bike to ride for a while.

 

[Craig]

I really appreciate the thoughts. I think I will need to take a few longer rides on the 400 before deciding. Maybe I can convince the wife she would like the 400 and I will get the 650. Then I can always borrow her bike.

 

[casek]

That is exactly what I did. My wife rides the 400 and I take the 650. We both love our individual bikes. She is 5'3 and I am 6'3 and both bikes work out well for both of us.

 

[Randy]

One of the things I like about both scooters is how well each handles everything from going shopping to going cross state.
Which one you end up with should depend on what the main use will be.
It's a fact that no one motorcycle can do it all .
The same is true of the 400 & 650 scooters except they come a lot closer :lol:

 

[Craig]

Well I spent the weekend taking the 400 on a couple of trips where highway speeds were a plus. I would say the scooter has no problem reaching any speed I care to travel and keeping up with traffic was not an issue.

Up here in Minnesota there seems to be a continuous issue with wind. At 50-55mph the wind did not seem to be a problem but when I cruised into the 60's I felt a little unsteady. Combine that with passing trucks and oncoming vehicles - well you get the picture.

Will the extra weight of the 650 make a big difference or do I just have new rider syndrome and need to log a few more miles to gain some more confidence on the bike?

 

[casek]

I prefer my 650 just for that reason, the wind. I ordered the Clearview XXL windshield to help to. The 650 just seemed to hold the road better for me than the 400 at higher speeds. My wife won't go much over 60 mph so the 400 works fine for her.

 

[garyw0cki]

I was a long term motorcycle rider that just went back to riding after a 10 year lay off. I started with an 150 Aprillia, just enough to get me interested again. I have new 400, 775 miles on it and I have ridden it at freeway speeds here in Vegas. No trouble maintaining 70, solid as arock unless our famous dessert wind kicks up. For me, it's perfect, easy to move around the garage and will do all I want it to. Maybe a 650 if my wife wants the 400, fat chance however.

 

[pauljo]

Will the extra weight of the 650 make a big difference or do I just have new rider syndrome and need to log a few more miles to gain some more confidence on the bike?

The 650 has more than just weight going for it. It has those big wide radial tires, it has a different suspension, and the heavy engine is located forward in the frame (more weight biased toward the front wheel is a good thing when it comes to stability in crosswinds).

But don't give up on the 400 yet. There are a couple of setup adjustments you want to try - and also work on riding technique.

Check your tire pressures. Make sure the front tire is at the lowest recommended setting, and that rear tire is at the highest recommended setting. On my 650, that is 33 psi front and 41 psi rear, but the 400 will be different - there is usually a plate on the scooter that gives the pressures, or you can find it in your owner's manual. Check the preload on your rear shock. If possible, increase it (make it stiffer). These adjustments will help bias weight transfer and suspension action toward the front wheel - best I can explain it. But I know it helps - I've done it on my scooter and my last couple of motorcycles. I ride in Nebraska & Iowa - both are major wind tunnels.

Don't get scared and put a death grip on the handlebars. That's a natural reaction. But as the wind tugs at you, you end up putting inputs into the handlebars that cause the scooter to wander back and forth. Relax your grip on the bars & let the wind shove your shoulders & head around a bit - it isn't going to blow you off the scooter... If you don't understand the principal of countersteering - learn it. A slight downward pressure on the handgrip on the side that the wind is coming from will keep you on course.

These same setup and riding techniques apply to the 650 as well - and folks who aren't aware of these things will get "blown around" on the bigger machine too. So work at it with the 400 you already own, and you should see some improvement - quite possibly enough improvement to give you confidence in that machine. And what you learn, will transfer to any other scooter or motorcycle you buy in the future.

 

[billmeek]

Well I spent the weekend taking the 400 on a couple of trips where highway speeds were a plus. I would say the scooter has no problem reaching any speed I care to travel and keeping up with traffic was not an issue.

Up here in Minnesota there seems to be a continuous issue with wind. At 50-55mph the wind did not seem to be a problem but when I cruised into the 60's I felt a little unsteady. Combine that with passing trucks and oncoming vehicles - well you get the picture.

Will the extra weight of the 650 make a big difference or do I just have new rider syndrome and need to log a few more miles to gain some more confidence on the bike?

Craig,

As a fairly new Burgman rider myself. I'd suggest putting on some miles before making a decision. At first, I felt the same as you about the stability over 55. Now I'm comfortable riding at 75 and have had the 400 up to 95. I still feel my best comfort zone is about 60 or so.

IMHO, part of the stability issue is the smaller wheels. The 400 responds quicker than larger wheeled bikes so minor changes at higher speeds have more of an effect. A lot of the issue for me has been the effect of wind. The buffeting on the head increases dramaticlly above 55 and makes it feel like the bike is bouncing more than it actually is.

At this point I'm debating on replacing the windshield or just investing in a much better helmet. I leaning toward the helmet because as Paul pointed out the bigger shields reduce air that I need to cool me off. The other option I'm considering is going with a larger shield and putting a vent in it to control the airflow.

The more I ride the 400... the more I've grown fond of it. For single riding, it suits my needs. If you're going to be riding 2 up, you might want the 650. The only times I've really wished I had the 650 is passing at higher speeds on 2 lane roads and when I've wanted to blow some other rider off the road. :twisted:

 

[Craig]

Fellow Riders,
Thanks for the feed back. I will try the adjustments mentioned by Paul. With just over 600 miles on my scooter I think most of the issues are with me and not the machine.

I have read many posts here where the 400 has traveled the highways and byways with no problems performing just as expected. I look forward to many more miles before the snow flies.

 

[Jim]

I might add, I owned the 400 for 3,000 miles. I noticed an increase in power @ the 1st service, and kept on increasing. At 3,000 miles, I felt it was still getting better.

If power is the only Issue, be patent, It does get better.

I went riding this weekend, I was 2-up on a 650 (4,500 miles) riding with a 400 solo rider (2,800 miles). I saw no problem with the 400 keeping up with me, we were running the expressway @ 75 Indicated and county roads @ 66-70 indicated.

 

[MikeLucey]

How about the issue of smoothness of ride? One would think a two cylinder machine would have less vibration, etc., than a one cylinder job. Do you all find that to be true of the 650 vs. the 400?

 

[Jim]

Yes the 650 is a bit smoother but the 400 isn' bad, but my decision was based on many things, Everyone has different tolerances, I needed a ride rivaling a touring machine. I did extensive work on my seat to get that ride and did get close. For me, long distance riding on a 400 wouldn't work out well, for others there is no problem, The weight issue is no problem for me, but it is with others.

 

[pauljo]

Mike,

I've had singles, twins and 4 cyl motorcycles. I've also ridden a couple of triples, and a 6 cyl Gold Wing. All motorcycles have some vibration, on some it is pleasant - on others annoying. I've had singles where the vibration was there, but but not uncomfortable - and I've had fours where the vibration at higher rpms was extremely annoying. My V-Strom is a big twin, and you can really feel the power pulses during accelleration, but that feels great! The AN650 is very smooth, there is some barely perceptable vibration at idle. At speed, it might as well be an electric motor. But even if the AN400 has some vibration, it doesn't necessarily mean that it's an issue. I can't remember anyone complaining about it.

 

[Brian]

I was surprised at how smooth the 650's twin was compared to 4s and 6s I've ridden.

The presence of counter-balancers, the CVT system, the method of mounting, etc. really do their job.

I haven't ridden the 400, but if it even comes close to the 650's smoothness then I can't imagine vibration being a significant issue.

New Slogan: This ain't your grampa's Indian! :lol:

 

[MikeLucey]

Thanks, guys. Not to complain about the 400; it's a great bike, and the more I ride it the more I like it. I was just wondering about the possible difference. The vibration in the 400 is indeed minimal - but you wouldn't mistake it for an electric motor either. Maybe I'm just groping for an excuse to trade up to a 650.

Anyhow, thanks again.

 

[roy_ryall]

I would add that the drive train on the 650 contributes to its smoothest over the 400 and other belt drived bikes.

 

[billmeek]

Maybe I'm just groping for an excuse to trade up to a 650.

Perfect excuse : "I want one."