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Discussion Starter #1
Well things have gotten a bit more complicated since my last post on my ignition switch problem http://burgmanusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7237, therefore I have created a new posting.

Today I took a fresh look at the igntion module after removing it again from the locking mechanism (Alburg had put it back in). As I look more closely at the rotating switch, I could see that the overheating of the switch was not caused by arcing as I originally thought, but by too much current flowing through the swtich - heating it up enough to melt plastic. :shock:

When I switch off the bike, the hot contact dimples buried themselves into the warmed plastic in their "off" position. When I came back and tried to start the bike, everything had cooled down and the key would not move because the contacts were buried into the dimple craters. So the burnt out module is the effect, not the cause. Drats! :cry:

Now I have to find out what caused this switch to get hot enough to melt and distort the plastic, but not blow a fuse. The contacts in the switch are in three pairs. The overheated pair are the contacts to the orange and red wires respectively.

Power from the regulator (red wire) comes throught the switch and goes out the orange wire to the fuse box for the headlight, the fuse box for ignition, the power source in the glove compartment, to a 10 amp power source fuse that runs to various other things and the passing light switch.

So before replacing this $400 CDN locking/ignition mechanism, I will have to look at each of the above items and find the root cause, otherwise I may ruin a new ignition module. :cry:

Nice way to spend my Summer vacation! :roll:

Here is the link to the pictures that I took today. You may find them interesting, or at least informative. :)

http://burgmanusa.com/gallery/album89

Sincerely hope none of you ever have this problem! Will keep you all updated as I dig deeper into this mystery! :)
 

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Reg, those are great photos!

Nice captions and arrows, etc. How'd you make them?

I wonder if the problem could be caused by the key being not fully "clicked" into a position. Could that cause a short circuit that would bypass the fuses -- a direct connect within the lock module?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I knew you would be lurking around. Was waiting to see how long it took you to find this post. :D :)

I use Paint Shop Pro 8 for my basic editing when I'm in a hurry (PhotoShop CS when I'm in a serious mood). In that inexpensive program is the ability to put arrows and text where you want them using layers. Can change sizes and colors also.

As to the problem, I won't really know until I start checking out the other circuits. But if I had to take a wild guess, I would say that it might involve the headlights. 8)
 

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vfdcaptain said:
I knew you would be lurking around. Was waiting to see how long it took you to find this post. :D :)
I would have been here sooner, but I'm at work (meaning I was on my other member's board, E-Budo.com). ;)

vfdcaptain said:
I use Paint Shop Pro 8 for my basic editing when I'm in a hurry (PhotoShop CS when I'm in a serious mood). In that inexpensive program is the ability to put arrows and text where you want them using layers. Can change sizes and colors also.
I've been out of the photo biz for so long that I'm really out of the loop. I've never used Photoshop or Paint Shop (just the basic "Paint" that comes with Windows). But I think I'm going to take a digital imaging class at the college this fall, since I need an art elective anyway.

I'm not going to give up film just yet, but with the use of the print and slide scanners I'm sure the school has I should be able to make a cross-media approach work.

vfdcaptain said:
As to the problem, I won't really know until I start checking out the other circuits. But if I had to take a wild guess, I would say that it might involve the headlights. 8)
Hmmm. That's surely something to consider.
 

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Reg thanks for the great photos and update. I am watching this thread with great curiosity.

It's 5:30 and I have to leave for work in 15 minutes but I will go over the schematics when I get home . You do have the manual yourself, right?
 

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dero said:
Gee I have to admit this fault definitely has that expensive look about it :cry:

You seem to have a few accessories fitted to the scooter that would be switched by the ignition switch such as the heated grips? How are they wired? Are there any other accessories fitted?

If it was my scoot I would initially assume that the standard wiring system is OK then I would do some intensive checking of any modifications I had made to the wiring system such as the heated grips etc. How much extra current do the mods draw?

The ignition switch could easily have too much current through it without blowing any fuses.
Good points. If you do install a new switch you might consider putting in a temporary lower current fuse and then swtich in your various mods, one at a time, to see if one of them is really the culprit.

The other suggestion is to contact Suzuki, send them the pictures and ask for their help. Make sure they get the point that this is being "worked on" on the forum (with it's big audience). It's certainly something that they should be interested in fixing.

Good luck,
 

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Nice Pix, thanks for that.
You should go into to service manual business!
 

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I would seriously look into the voltage regulator. You may want to try hooking up a voltmeter and checking voltage in the system, should be around 13.5 to 14v max while running. Anything higher and you got a problem. Not likely the cause since the battery usually tends to boil in this situation but it's the only thing I can think of at this point in time.
 

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Great set of pictures, Reg. I was wondering if the headlight bulbs are stock or if maybe the previous owner changed them to 100/55 or something like that. This kind of ignition switch melt-down was common with Hondas back in the 70's when people were installing Vetter fairings with lots of extra lights and stuff on their CB750K's. At least, it was easy and cheap to replace the switch module and I kept a stock of the 3 or 4 types that fit most Hondas. They were available as after-market parts and readily available. I can't understand why that module wouldn't be available by itself except for them wanting to make more money by selling the whole thing. It should be an interchangeable replacement part, fitting several models of bike. Hope you get it resolved soon so you don't miss out on the rest of the good weather.
 

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sounds like an excessive amount of amps flowing thru the system.
and a fuse didn't blow first.
probably because the way your excessories are wired into the system..
interested to know the culprit..
keep us posted.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
You seem to have a few accessories fitted to the scooter that would be switched by the ignition switch such as the heated grips? How are they wired? Are there any other accessories fitted?

The only accessory that is wired into the bike is the heated grips and they were not turned on that night (professionally installed). Oh, & I also have a GIVI Top Box, but that is wired into the taillight circuit.

I am sending this message thread to Suzuki Canada (with the pictures) to see if they have any ideas. :idea:

Also leaving in a few minutes to Nanaimo (two hours north of my home) to see if Harbour City Motorsport's mechanics have any ideas. The local Suzuki dealer showed no interest in helping me out, so I'm going elsewhere to seek help (will not be buying my new Burgman Executive from the local dealer next May - they've lost my business, period).

I was wondering if the headlight bulbs are stock or if maybe the previous owner changed them to 100/55 or something like that.
Thanks Wes, I didn't think of that. They sure are nice bright lights (better than my car), so I will pop one out and look to see how many watts it is. I was planning on running a wire from the battery through a relay to the headlights anyhow. That way all the power is not going through the switches and thin wiring. Ditto for the horn (when I add the more powerful horns).

You do have the manual yourself, right?
Yes, Allwalk, I do have a factory manual. Borrowed it from Alburg. :D (thanks Al!)
 

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Reg

I am sorry to hear of this problem but you are handling it with the tenacity and method of a real pro.

As to cause - well I do not think it is anything to do with voltage per se - the over heating is due to excess current or it could just be a 'bad' switch in the first place with high resistive contacts (read s h i t ) - which again is going to draw excess current - the heating effect (as I am sure you know is equal to the square of the current times the resistance).

It would be nice just to be able to order that part (maybe our friends in Japan could help here) are there any identifying parts or numbers on there - I would not hold my breath but maybe even Suzuki could come with an answer there - it does not look more than a £10 part (read £1 to manufacture).

Could you send the links to Suzuki HQ in Japan?

Time to stir the pot here. :)

I watch developments with a (vested) interest.

Thanks once again for alerting the forum to the detail of this worrying failure. I am sure you will keep us posted. :)
 

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Looking at the fiche for the USA version, that lock assembly is sold as a unit, the module itself isn't listed as a part.
A quick online check shows the part available for about $130usd + shipping for just the switch and keys, or $188usd + shipping if you want the gas cap and glovebox key latch included.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Here is a copy of the e-mail that I sent to Suzuki Canada. Hopefully they will be able to help me (maybe even get me the part for FREE or at least less money). :)


Dear Sir,

Could you please forward this e-mail unto someone who can help me with solving my problem with my beloved Burgman 650 with only 12,000 kms on it. It was working perfectly right up until I turned off the bike to go into the house to drop something off. When I went outside to start the bike, the ignition switch would not turn. I have always done the work on my bikes, but have never had this problem before, especially without warning.

I have included a link to the BurgmanUSA site that outlines the problem.

http://burgmanusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7237

Then after more investigation:

http://burgmanusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7374

Also, here is the link to the pictures that I took showing the damage.

http://burgmanusa.com/gallery/album89

I must say that this has been the best bike that I have ever owned in the last 39 years. I really enjoy riding it! I was going to buy a 2005 Executive in May, but twice your office told me last Fall that the Executive's were not coming to Canada, so I bought this beautifully maintained used Burgman instead. I will buy a new Executive next Spring, but right now it's Summertime, I am on holidays and I need to get this problem solved quickly.

All my friends at BurgmanUSA are watching to see what was the cause, & what is the final result. Thank you for any help or advice that Suzuki can offer me.

Regards,
Reginald Page

BTW. - why is the locking mechanism $400 in Canada, yet only $151 (~$197 Cdn) in the States from Ron Ayers? This is huge difference.
 

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Try http://www.crotchrocket.com. Putting part # 37110-10820 returns a price of $136.55. Don't know if in stock or not, they don't say, but I bet you could call them and ask.

By the way, I've found Ron Ayers to be rather pricey among the online Burgman part suppliers. I'm sure they are a fine company, though.

Another place I've gotten good prices on, only a bitty bit higher priced than the crotchrocket is http://www.oneidasuzuki.com. I tried searching for your part on their website, but it didn't work for some reason their search function must be really slow or down. But they get stuff pretty quickly to me.
 

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vfdcaptain said:
Also leaving in a few minutes to Nanaimo (two hours north of my home) to see if Harbour City Motorsport's mechanics have any ideas.
Hey Reg, I must have just missed you. I was in the shop, making sure they have a rear tire for me and making an appointment to have it put on before I do a run to the East Kootenies in a couple of weeks. That will be the second rear I've put on this year. This one will only have about 25,000 km and would prolly make it to 30,000 but I'll feel better with a new one for the trip. What success did you have with them?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Wes said:
What success did you have with them?
Hi Wes,

Suzuki Customer Service answered my e-mail within a couple of minutes of receiving it. :) They wanted my VIN number. They also said that they would pass the e-mail on to their tech department and would e-mail the info back.

Could take a couple of days, but a least they didn't blow me off like the mechanic at the local dealer did. :shock: I may have to find a way to get my bike up to Harbour City Motorsports in Nanaimo to get it checked out.

But at the moment, I have put the bike's fate in Suzuki's hands and trust that I have favor with them. :) In the past I have had good success with my Suzuki's. Even wrote a letter once to the President of Suzuki in Japan to tell him how much I enjoyed my GS 1000E. It was a bullet-proof bike with over 100,000 miles on it!
 

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That sounds very encouraging, Reg. I guess a lot of us will be holding our breath, waiting to see what happens. I just hope it happens soon so you can get back on the road before the summer runs out.
 
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