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Discussion Starter #1
Ladies and Gents,

It's been a while since I have been "up in here."

Looking for some Scooter advice. About a year ago, a friend at work rode up on a Honda Rebel 250. And a flood of memories came back to me, and I fell in love all over again. When I was about 13 years old, my dad came home with a Honda Rebel brochure. I must have read that thing cover to cover 50 times. He never did buy a Rebel though. So after seeing my friend's Rebel, I found one for sell that had 44 miles on it. And I got it cheap.

Currently I have a 2016 Rebel, and a 2011 Suzuki Burgman Executive ABS. I dropped the insurance on the Burgman, and did not register it again. And have spent the previous year riding the Rebel. It now has about 3,100 miles on it. It is a great little bike. I just left the Burgman sitting in the garage and have only cranked it a time or two. But I have too much in the garage now, especially in the left side of the garage.

Also, on the same side of the garage, I have an ATV, my son's dirtbike (CR 85R), and my 72 Plymouth Scamp. I've been Scamping it a pretty good bit here lately, and I'm worn out on having to move the Rebel and the Burgman out of the way. I'm looking to downsize to just one sickle. Then maybe I can ram that one sickle close enough against the wall to not need to move it when I go out Scamping around.

If I were to downsize, which sickle should I retain? Let me list the things I like and dislike about each.

REBEL
Likes
  • Super simple. Maintenance is a snap. Nearly nothing. Change the oil. No filter. Adjust the valves every 4k miles. Easy.
  • Decent styling.
  • Drivetrain is (how to describe), a joy. A true manual transmission, and rides "free" and puts a rider in good control. It is the epitome of freedom on 2 wheels.
  • Great mpg. Averaging 65-ish mpg.
  • Easy to push around / move when not running.
  • Seemingly lots of spare parts around (but haven't much needed anything).
Dislikes
  • It is so small, it feels not visible enough when I'm riding it.
  • Carrying a passenger is just not a good idea. The seat is too small, the horses are too small, and the comfort when 2 up is too small. A long distance ride would probably only happen once 2-up and the passenger would never do it again. The driver may not want to either.
  • I can only carry as much as I can stuff in a backpack. And a backpack leaves my back hot and sweaty, not comfortable.
  • 72 mph is the top speed on level ground. Not so much a negative, as it get's the job done. I'm not racing any longer.
These are just minor complaints, except the passenger thing. I wouldn't mind hauling The Warden around if I ever make it out of solitary confinement (not likely).


Burgman
Likes
  • It's got to be twice as fat as the Rebel. Wider / longer / with bodywork. Lots of brake lights in comparison to the Rebel. Due to the size, it feels much safer when I ride it, because I feel noticeable.
  • It does perform well, good acceleration, good brakes.
  • It is more comfortable than the Rebel.
  • It can carry a passenger in real comfort, and can do so effortlessly. A passenger would have a pleasant time on the Burgman.
  • It has storage space out the ying-yang, as you guys know. It has built in storage, plus the P.O. added a trunk box that is enormous, looks nice, serves as a passenger backrest, and has a brake light and reflectors on the back. Lots of brake lights on this thing.
  • If I ride it long distance, there is no need for a back pack. It can take a stuffed full back pack and store it 2 different places and have plenty of room left in either storage location. I can purchase some groceries and carry it home.
  • I can get off the Burgman, and store the helmet locked inside, and walk into places with my hands free. I have to carry the helmet around with me when I'm on the Rebel.
  • It'll go faster than I'll ever want to. It will run probably 110 mph as you guys know.
Dislikes
  • Due to the CVT, it is a big fat stubborn pig to move around when it is not running.
  • The fuel mileage is lower than expectations. I really have to try hard to hit 50 mpg. The average mpg is less than 50 mpg.
  • The wind noise on the interstate is higher than my expectations. But this can be improved with a bigger windscreen.
  • The fact that the speedo is off optimistically by 9% annoys the living …. out of me.

The simplest way to compare the two are to say the Rebel is kind of like a SmartForTwo car. Small, simple, easy.
The Burgman is like a Ford Raptor. Big, fast, comfortable can carry around a bunch of stuff.

To be honest, I'm considering selling the Rebel and riding the Burgman exclusively. If I regret having sold the Rebel, I could buy a V-Star 250. As I think that may fit me a bit better than a Rebel. And I do like the micro engine bikes. Course I like big ugly monster engine bikes too … like the Yamaha V-Max. There's not too many 2 wheelers that I don't like.

Opinions? Feedback? Suggestions? Comments? Questions? Concerns?


7milesout
 

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Ladies and Gents,

It's been a while since I have been "up in here."

Looking for some Scooter advice. About a year ago, a friend at work rode up on a Honda Rebel 250. And a flood of memories came back to me, and I fell in love all over again. When I was about 13 years old, my dad came home with a Honda Rebel brochure. I must have read that thing cover to cover 50 times. He never did buy a Rebel though. So after seeing my friend's Rebel, I found one for sell that had 44 miles on it. And I got it cheap.

Currently I have a 2016 Rebel, and a 2011 Suzuki Burgman Executive ABS. I dropped the insurance on the Burgman, and did not register it again. And have spent the previous year riding the Rebel. It now has about 3,100 miles on it. It is a great little bike. I just left the Burgman sitting in the garage and have only cranked it a time or two. But I have too much in the garage now, especially in the left side of the garage.

Also, on the same side of the garage, I have an ATV, my son's dirtbike (CR 85R), and my 72 Plymouth Scamp. I've been Scamping it a pretty good bit here lately, and I'm worn out on having to move the Rebel and the Burgman out of the way. I'm looking to downsize to just one sickle. Then maybe I can ram that one sickle close enough against the wall to not need to move it when I go out Scamping around.

If I were to downsize, which sickle should I retain? Let me list the things I like and dislike about each.

REBEL
Likes
  • Super simple. Maintenance is a snap. Nearly nothing. Change the oil. No filter. Adjust the valves every 4k miles. Easy.
  • Decent styling.
  • Drivetrain is (how to describe), a joy. A true manual transmission, and rides "free" and puts a rider in good control. It is the epitome of freedom on 2 wheels.
  • Great mpg. Averaging 65-ish mpg.
  • Easy to push around / move when not running.
  • Seemingly lots of spare parts around (but haven't much needed anything).
Dislikes
  • It is so small, it feels not visible enough when I'm riding it.
  • Carrying a passenger is just not a good idea. The seat is too small, the horses are too small, and the comfort when 2 up is too small. A long distance ride would probably only happen once 2-up and the passenger would never do it again. The driver may not want to either.
  • I can only carry as much as I can stuff in a backpack. And a backpack leaves my back hot and sweaty, not comfortable.
  • 72 mph is the top speed on level ground. Not so much a negative, as it get's the job done. I'm not racing any longer.
These are just minor complaints, except the passenger thing. I wouldn't mind hauling The Warden around if I ever make it out of solitary confinement (not likely).


Burgman
Likes
  • It's got to be twice as fat as the Rebel. Wider / longer / with bodywork. Lots of brake lights in comparison to the Rebel. Due to the size, it feels much safer when I ride it, because I feel noticeable.
  • It does perform well, good acceleration, good brakes.
  • It is more comfortable than the Rebel.
  • It can carry a passenger in real comfort, and can do so effortlessly. A passenger would have a pleasant time on the Burgman.
  • It has storage space out the ying-yang, as you guys know. It has built in storage, plus the P.O. added a trunk box that is enormous, looks nice, serves as a passenger backrest, and has a brake light and reflectors on the back. Lots of brake lights on this thing.
  • If I ride it long distance, there is no need for a back pack. It can take a stuffed full back pack and store it 2 different places and have plenty of room left in either storage location. I can purchase some groceries and carry it home.
  • I can get off the Burgman, and store the helmet locked inside, and walk into places with my hands free. I have to carry the helmet around with me when I'm on the Rebel.
  • It'll go faster than I'll ever want to. It will run probably 110 mph as you guys know.
Dislikes
  • Due to the CVT, it is a big fat stubborn pig to move around when it is not running.
  • The fuel mileage is lower than expectations. I really have to try hard to hit 50 mpg. The average mpg is less than 50 mpg.
  • The wind noise on the interstate is higher than my expectations. But this can be improved with a bigger windscreen.
  • The fact that the speedo is off optimistically by 9% annoys the living …. out of me.

The simplest way to compare the two are to say the Rebel is kind of like a SmartForTwo car. Small, simple, easy.
The Burgman is like a Ford Raptor. Big, fast, comfortable can carry around a bunch of stuff.

To be honest, I'm considering selling the Rebel and riding the Burgman exclusively. If I regret having sold the Rebel, I could buy a V-Star 250. As I think that may fit me a bit better than a Rebel. And I do like the micro engine bikes. Course I like big ugly monster engine bikes too … like the Yamaha V-Max. There's not too many 2 wheelers that I don't like.

Opinions? Feedback? Suggestions? Comments? Questions? Concerns?


7milesout
Rebel is very limited in many ways moving forward, as told by you to me. The Burgman has so many plusses, two up, huge storage, stow 2 helmets on the Burgman, twice as fast, fun to ride. A real touring bike if needed. Two up in comfort. Spring summer and fall. If you, like me have the stamina for the Pig roll, that's where I'd leave me.

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk
 

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with the rebel, you are riding your high school sweetheart, a memory, good but a memory. If you sold the burg, how much would it cost to replace it later when the dream fades.
 

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Have you asked on the Rebel Forum,I think we may be a tad biased on here.
Biased, here? ;)

A few years ago another worker brought his Honda Rebel 250 to work. He rode it 55 miles one way so he lived out farther than my 41 miles. Anyway, the whole week he rode it. We left the yard at the same time and both jumped up on the freeway and over to the Car Pool lane. At 70 MPH he was bent over the bars and it was screaming loud. Not my cup of tea. For the next few days I'd leave before he did as I did not want to be stuck behind that racket or having to pass him and put him in shame. He would have done anything to stay in front of me, that was his way.
 

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I get 50.3 mpg on my 2015 Burg. I have noticed different types of fuel gives it different MPG's. Mine actually gets the best MPG and runs better with Sunoco or BP. Maybe try a different gas station for better MPG for your burg. I love my Burg and wouldn't want to get rid of it ever. Is it hard to move around, yeah but I've been able to get used to having to move it and is a little easier for me now than when I first had it. Mind you I'm 5'3 and 140 lbs, but I figured out a good way for me to move it around.
 

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In these cases it's sometimes hard to make a decision based on quantitative data/analysis.

So, maybe go with your gut ... which one do you like riding better, is more practical for your needs and gives you the most pleasure to ride?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
... twice as fast, fun to ride. A real touring bike if needed.
Dannspride - It is twice as fast, or thereabouts, but don't be mistaken, it is FUN TO RIDE. It is a more technical ride than the Burgman which I enjoy and has good handling, brakes, etc. It has better slow speed manners than the Burgman (due to the small weight and drivetrain). Mine will do 72 mph ± hills & wind. 72 mph on flat level ground. Mine has the stock exhaust and has a nice little rumble at idle. Otherwise sort of sounds like a sewing machine, not too different than the Burgman really. Same type of engine, parallel twin. It's actually only 238 cc's I believe. I really don't mind it being slow. The ride on the interstate can be enjoyable. I don't lean into it like a sportbike, that's just silly on a cruiser. But I draft other traffic. No, I don't draft close. Because it is at it's top speed at 72 mph, it is VERY wind direction sensitive. So you can draft cars from way back. Gain on them, pull out and pass. It's kind of fun. I rode 4 full tanks of gas doing that and it was a blast. At W.O.T. for 4 tanks it averaged 56 mpg. So that would be its minimum mpg I guess. 56 mpg min / 65 mpg average / 84 mpg max.

Have you asked on the Rebel Forum,I think we may be a tad biased on here.
I posted virtually the same thing there.

At 70 MPH he was bent over the bars and it was screaming loud.
Evidently he's not running the stock exhaust. Mine is not loud.

I get 50.3 mpg on my 2015 Burg ... but I figured out a good way for me to move it around.
I got 50.3 mpg on mine once. I keep all my info on the fuelly app. One issue for me is I work very close to home. So, it doesn't see too very much cruising action ... say 50 - 60 mph. It's either around town, or doing 75 mph on the interstate. I think I'm going to, for now, just drop insurance on the Rebel and pick it back up on the Burgman. And see if I can like it.

I sort of fell out of love with it during the first 900 miles. We'll see what happens this time.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I just realized, I can probably mount my dash cam on the Burgman. I cannot on the Rebel. Will have to figure out how to quieten down the wind noise maybe. That should be fun footage to watch. I forget … we do have a 12V outlet don't we? (I'm not at home to check).
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Oh, and one more thing I like about the Burgman, I forgot to post in my original post. I love the fact that it has, and the use of the centerstand. Maybe all non sportbikes should have them. Now, on a daily basis when I park somewhere, I just use the kickstand. But when I want to use it, and do so, it is awesome. Like at the gas station. And doing service, and checking fluids. It is super useful.
 

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Try wearing earplugs when you ride, especially when riding above 50 MPH.
They are recommenced for ear protection when riding.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I will be using earbuds and listening to music henceforth. I put an X-Mount on the Rebel. I'm going to move it over to the Burgman.
 

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"I will be using earbuds and listening to music henceforth. I put an X-Mount on the Rebel. I'm going to move it over to the Burgman."

Two suggestions to elevate your riding game ....

1. Trekz bone conduction headphones. You can wear earplugs to protect your hearing, enjoy music AND still hear traffic and voices. With these you "hear" music outside your ear. The fidelity is amazing. One caveat: they don't fit inside a helmet. Titanium

2. RAM Quick Grip cell phone cradle. I had the X-mount and never felt comfortable with it. This holder is spring-loaded and you can insert your phone with one hand, in two seconds. Rock-solid. https://www.amazon.com/RAM-MOUNTS-RAM-HOL-PD3U-Universal-Spring/dp/B0088LL7UA
 

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:)
It's really about what you need to accomplish with the bike, and none of US can answer that question for YOU. You need the right tool for the job, but you haven't really described what the job is. A hammer and a screwdriver are both fine tools, but are you dealing with a nail or a screw?

For what it's worth, I think the Dislikes you list for the Burgman are mostly kinda silly.
  • Due to the CVT, it is a big fat stubborn pig to move around when it is not running.
  • The fuel mileage is lower than expectations. I really have to try hard to hit 50 mpg. The average mpg is less than 50 mpg.
  • The wind noise on the interstate is higher than my expectations. But this can be improved with a bigger windscreen.
  • The fact that the speedo is off optimistically by 9% annoys the living …. out of me.
  • The first one is very real, which is why I say "mostly" kinda silly.
  • Really, how much does fuel economy matter? Are you riding that much? Calculate how much fuel you use in a year using one bike, then with the other, and then figure out what the difference is in actual annual cost. It isn't going to be much unless you're riding like a maniac.
  • Wind noise? Lots of ways to fix that, as indicated in posts above and by you in the dislike, itself.
  • Speedo error? Really??? Frankly, I'd be reluctant to give advice to anyone who is bothered that much by speedometer error. My priorities are obviously differently ordered than yours, and I suspect that I am not well qualified to see the world through your eyes and perceptions.
Whatever you do, make sure you keep riding SOMETHING!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I got insurance re-established on the Burgman. And then got it registered again yesterday and rode around on it. It is exactly where I left it. After sitting for a year, it cranked back up. I did crank it maybe twice over the year. I then rode it around some and went and added gas. 48+ mpg on that year old tank.

I can deal with the big fat stubborn pig to move around. It seems to want to roll back easier than roll forward. Easy enough, just crank it to roll it forward. And I think I read that parking it either in POWER mode or MANUAL mode makes it easier to push around also. I'll experiment.

But riding it around, and the wind noise is an abomination. It's a combination of issues. 1. I'm longer in the back than the legs, so I stick up higher. 2. I'm using a modular helmet so it will be a bit louder too. However, I have made the necessary corrections.

Today I purchased the XL windshield from Clearview, with the vents. I purchased their biggest variation because as I was riding, I would move my head down with the windshield all the way up, and guesstimated that 4 inches additional height was what I needed. The XL from Clearview is 3.5" taller. Plus the recurve shape and extra width will help. My thinking was that even if the windshield were to be too tall, I can lower it down. I think it will be great, and really tone down the wind noise. I thought the vents were a great idea, so I got the vented version.

I also order the 3 Brothers Performance backrest. My back hurts a bit while riding it, not a huge deal. But the backrest will make it much more comfortable. If it is quiet and comfortable enough, I may fall asleep riding it.

Next I'm going to figure out what I want to do for a phone mount. Correction, I bought the RAM X mount that I use on the Rebel. I think there is a ball mount accessory that can be attached to the brake master cylinder top cover. I'm going to have to learn about that too. I'll want power to my phone as well.

Thanks for the feedback!


7milesout
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Rode it up to my Paw's house. 140 miles. Topped off on my way out and stopped and refueled when I got here. 50.694 mpg.

Tried to hold it at 72 mph, the maximum speed of the Rebel. Also used no ethanol gas. I was shooting for 50 mpg, so I was successful!


7milesout
 

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Speedo Healer can solve the 9% optimistic issue....a second one can drive performance much higher than it already is.

It sounds like you have almost made your mind up...you like to ride the Honda more, but you know the Burgy is a much better bike in most, although not all respects. I personally have more than one type of bike to satisfy my different needs/wants. But in the last couple years I have noticed that I ride the other bikes less and less and the Burgman's more and more almost exclusively.

Go with your heart...but I suggest keep both.
 
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Why not split the difference? Sell both bikes and get a Burgman 400. Best of both worlds. Light and small enough, yet great highway manners. It’s definitely a bike you can ride into old age.
 
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Discussion Starter #19
I just got back home. I was going to leave later, but a look at the radar, hell and damnation was minutes away from his house and moving in from north to south. And I had to go south. So I jumped up and ran out the door as quick as I could. I was going to top off before leaving because I had sported around town a bit on that tank. But I would have got pummeled with rain so I just hit the interstate.

I still got pummeled hard for about 10 miles but dried up pretty good after. I could tell I had a decent tailwind because the wind noise was less and I could hear the bike run a little. The fuel emblem was blinking when I got back in town so I topped off again. The return fuel mileage, including the sporting around yielded 51.667 mpg. So yeah, I had a good tailwind. And I ran 72 mph again to run the same speed as my Rebel can do.

At the very least, this test demonstrates that my particular Burgman runs nominally. I'm happy with that. Can't wait for the backrest and windscreen. And in the future I think I'm going to do the Rostra cruise.

Deeda: Seems like I remember the speedo healer has some side effects that I don't think I would care to deal with. Seems like it was something to do with cvt dynamics / driveability.

Liamjs: I drove a 400 once. It would have been about a 2008 I guess. Waaaaay too much vibration with that single cylinder. Otherwise I think I would be ok with it power wise.


7milesout
 

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...

Deeda: Seems like I remember the speedo healer has some side effects that I don't think I would care to deal with. Seems like it was something to do with cvt dynamics / driveability.
...
That's why he mentioned the second speedo healer. One goes to the speedometer to dial out the 9% optimistic reading. The second goes to the transmission controller, and dials that 9% error back in so the transmission responds normally.
 
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