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Returned Sunday from Daytona and Biketoberfest. I drove the 650 alone, and then took it out again with the wife checking out the back seat. Both of us were very impressed. They led us on a route that included some actual curves, and a couple of straights that allowed 75+ MPH for short stints. Wife bought a new 400 Burgman in 2008, and still loves it. Her scoot is a keeper for her. After this test drive, I'm considering trading in my 2011 Suzuki cruiser for a 650 Burgman. There is simply no comparison between the two Burgman's for solo or two up riding. None! And that's with five years experience with the 400 under our belts. The 650 gets a :thumbup:
 

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I know what you mean! I traded my VStar 1100 Classic in on mine. Nothing wrong with the VStar but wife could not be made comfortable, it required a lot more concentration from dead stops on hills with her on it and it definitely did not handle the twisties nearly as well as the Burgman. Now, she just sits back there and enjoys the ride. She can stay on longer than me now! That's what I like. She constantly extolls the comfort of this machine from the smoothness to the nice wide seat. My friends are still in shock but they will secretly admire from a distance. :wink:
 

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Chaplain KC said:
I know what you mean! I traded my VStar 1100 Classic in on mine. Nothing wrong with the VStar but wife could not be made comfortable, it required a lot more concentration from dead stops on hills with her on it and it definitely did not handle the twisties nearly as well as the Burgman. Now, she just sits back there and enjoys the ride. She can stay on longer than me now! That's what I like. She constantly extolls the comfort of this machine from the smoothness to the nice wide seat. My friends are still in shock but they will secretly admire from a distance. :wink:
Interesting comments, as one who has a 2007 Dragstar 1100 Classic in amongst my stable of rides (2011 XT1200Z, AN650K7, AN650K3, 2007 XVS1100AC, 2010 CF250T-6A, 1990 K1). The look of the Dragstar and the fact that is has a really dependable shaft drive is something that I do at times miss or think about, given the known issues and vulnerability/reliability of the AN650 transmission. If there is one thing that I wish that Suzuki would take heed off would be making the tranny more robust for those (many) amongst us that do the miles. While there are moments I do like to ride the Dragstar, more often than not it is passed up for one of the maxi scoots, which are just so darn functional in all manner of situations. Just wish someone would take a gamble on a dual purpose maxi scoot design... 8)
 

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. Just wish someone would take a gamble on a dual purpose maxi scoot design... 8)
You too eh- with the ability to change the CVT characteristics it's interesting. I take the Burgman on dirt fairly often but I'm nervous about standing on the floor boards and the road tires are horrid in anything approaching sand or damp. Was squirming yesterday on a flat dirt road with a few puddles.

But the low CofG and mild tuning almost begs for a duallie - having the ability to kick the gearing down to tractor level would be terrific.
Honda's DCT might be more adaptable tho the CVT should have some advantages.

I'd even settle for a 400 to keep weight down. I do like the idea of not having to clutch.
I got off the Burgman after a summer of riding and onto a BMW 650 thumper and took a couple of tumbles in the sand on a mild slope.....oh er yeah that's a clutch - hmmmmmmmmm.
Did okay on the trails as the KLR experience kicked back in.
Found the BMW too heavy and while shorter was wide and a killer on the hips as a result.
 

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It's all the effect of big cc, I guess, additional cylinder, slightly better response on the road and resilience to gusty conditions. Did i forget anything
 

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Hey TwoWheeler:

I new youwould enjoy the 650 for two up and on the highway. :cheers:
 

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Discussion Starter #8
blackcat54 said:
OP.....

Could you give more details of the "no comparison" between the two Burgmans?
The 650 is smoother at all speeds, almost zero vibration. Engine braking is great as the 650 transmission stays engaged much longer, almost to a stop. The 650 is simply much easier to drive slow; And u-turns are like with a motorcycle. Her 400 freewheels/coasts at about 15 MPH making slow driving and u-turns very hard without increasing RPM's and/or riding the brake. As far as the wife riding on back of each scooter, she says the wind blast is much worse on the 400 for the passenger. She thinks the rear seating might be higher on the 400 placing her in the wind more. The 650 would be her scooter of choice for two up riding. When the woman is happy, everyone is happy.
 

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ScooterJohn said:
Hey TwoWheeler:

I new youwould enjoy the 650 for two up and on the highway. :cheers:
I've been fighting it for almost 5 years now. I'll probably have to give in and buy a 650 Burgman.
 

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Bolzen said:
It's all the effect of big cc, I guess, additional cylinder, slightly better response on the road and resilience to gusty conditions. Did i forget anything
It's not a slightly better response it is a huge difference.
 

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TwoWheelers said:
ScooterJohn said:
Hey TwoWheeler:

I new youwould enjoy the 650 for two up and on the highway. :cheers:
I've been fighting it for almost 5 years now. I'll probably have to give in and buy a 650 Burgman.
I just did it and am not looking back. :thumbup:
 

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The 400 freewheels below 15mph?

What do you do if you want to cruise at 12mph?

Consider this....from a stop, the clutch engages and you start moving from 0 to whatever, right? Suppose you start from 0 and accelerate to 10mph and keep it there? Will the clutch disengage at a steady 10mph?
 

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Cruise at 12 mph? Cruise? ;) :?

When I get into stop and go traffic that is barely moving at walking speed, I simply use enough throttle to move along. There's no jerk when it engages and when it disengages. There's no need to feather the rear brake. It just works smoothly.

I've done it for an hour at a time, several times. It simply works.

Chris
 

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Daboo said:
There's no jerk when it engages and when it disengages.
This is the key at slow movement. The 650 usually jerks more, which is ok with the driver but not the pillion. Almost every time you accelerate or slow down, the helmets collide and there's no clutch to smooth the action.
 

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I used to have the Suzuki M50. The C50T has the same engine except with touring accessories. I added a 20" windscreen to my M50. When I tried going from L.A. to San Francisco.. the engine felt like it needed a 6th gear, there was enough vibration on the throttle to make my hand numb. I did not even consider it enjoyable touring on the Suzuki M50 even when I added touring amenities(windscreen, soft luggage). The M50 engine at an indicated 80mph does have the same speedometer error as the B650, but at that speed the engine feel like it is working too hard and not comfortable passing cages at an indicated 80mph.

Even though the M50 and C50 have the 800cc engine, it is no comparison to the Burgman 650cc engine in smoothness and cruising at an indicated 80+mph.

Their is much controversy over the CVT making the B650 a disposable motorcycle if we don't have the skills of LeDude and Buffalo to wrench our bike if the CVT goes out. I didn't know how detailed the work entailed of wrenching the CVT and assembly until I saw post, pictures from LeDude and Buffalo with videos from LeDude on what they go through to repair their B650 CVT.

Since I don't have time to tour as much as I did before; it may be easier to get a simpler bike if I decide to trade-in my present B650E -if I really want to tour for several days on a Burgman 650/650E, I would rent the Burgman 650/650E and not worry about the CVT. Of course if you are touring long distance on a regular bases -the option to buy the B650 would justify the cost or renting one.
 

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So the 400 doesn't have a CVT issue? Ride forever and just clean and replace sliders? (serious question, I do not know)
 

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The 400 is belt driven with a similar drive to the Silverwing. When I had the Silverwing, you just swap out the belt aka "rubber band" and when needed swap out the roller bearings. Otherwise you never have to worry about pulling apart the whole bike to get to the transmission like the Burgman CVT.

Of course some people get lucky and can go 60,000-80,000+mi without ever going into the CVT, but on some other post by 30,000mi when something happens to the B650 CVT -it's time to pull the whole bike apart.

What's worse is that it can have a cascading effect so that if the mechanic fixes one problem, but ignores another less serious problem because it "ain't broke yet". If it does break say in 5,000mi more or less, the whole B650 needs to be torn apart as well as the CVT.

For this reason LeDude and Buffalo have such detailed documentation on how they fixed or are fixing their CVT and swapping out parts that could break, showing how to reassemble the B650 properly rather than waiting for the bike to break down again thus having to disassemble the entire B650 again :oops:

It's not that the average dealership mechanic cannot do the job properly. Most dealership mechanics have skill, but have other bikes to work on. It may seem that LeDude is taking forever on his CVT, but he is putting in the passion to do the work properly without taking unnecessary shortcuts.
 

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typhoon said:
Trade it in at 25K and you will never have to worry about any problems...
Too late for some of us, that just over 1 years riding. :D Am at about 31,000 miles now.
 

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Dave_J said:
typhoon said:
Trade it in at 25K and you will never have to worry about any problems...
Too late for some of us, that just over 1 years riding. :D Am at about 31,000 miles now.
It is never too late :wink: , trade it in at 31,000 mi and be grateful you have a buffer of 6,000+mi 8)
 
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