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Sliders flipped again?

6K views 50 replies 13 participants last post by  model28a 
#1 ·
Ok - so these 21g sliders are pretty good, but it seems about 800 to 1000 miles after I install them all the sudden your riding along and notice the RPM's on the freeway are back up to about where they are with the rollers. I take it all apart and find that 1 or 2 of them will be flipped backwards. I correct this, blow out the dust and its good for another 1000 miles. This morning I looked down to see 7000rpms at 80mph indicated so I know they have flipped again. I don't understand why, my variator doesn't have ridges at the top and otherwise I haven't altered anything. I like them alot but I am getting tired of taking it apart constantly to fix this.
 
#3 ·
Not right now, I put them all back in a while back because I was going to be doing all highway riding for the next few months. I am getting a bit tired of the re-work though. I can't figure out how this is happening, looking at them in there it makes no sense one could flip.
 
#4 ·
I can imagine them flipping easily, that's what i don't like about this idea. In fact i was more sure they would flip than they wouldn't. Try to clean and grease the variator movable parts concurrently checking if anything could prevent plate from smooth operation.
 
#5 ·
I guess right now for reliabilities sake I'll just put the rollers back in since my work schedule is going to become demanding and I might not have time to keep taking things apart over and over again.

The main reason I wanted these was because the 7000rpm's at 80 indicated made me think the engine was over stressed which I have learned from reading here isn't true. Otherwise their performance is slightly better at low speeds but I didn't dislike the rollers either. I know when on hills or headwinds being stuck at 5300rpm's isn't very good for performance, but on just flat roads its nice and raises the MPG's some.

As long as the higher RPM's aren't over working the engine with the rollers then I guess for now I'll just stay stock and leave it alone.
 
#7 ·
I keep a tight hold on it and don't let them move if thats what you mean. Why do you think they go so long before they flip. This is really bugging me because I like them for the most part, but taking it apart over and over again is getting old.
 
#8 ·
I to had 19 gram ones in for 33k+ miles & never had them turn over. Sure don't know why yours would be doing that. :scratch:
 
#10 ·
My 18g ones did about 4000 miles then 2 flipped, cleaned it out and they have been ok
for about 5000 ok so far, not a clue as to why it happens though.
 
#11 ·
So far the furthest I've gotten is 1000 miles before a flip. First time I got about 600, second time close to 1000. and today just a little over 1000 since the last time.

 
#14 · (Edited)
Somehow you've got an excessive dust blow to the inside. Definitely not the best condition for the sliders to run.

The belt might really be giving up, so it just lets out more powder. It's not only miles that ages it but time and condition also, or it even could be some cheaper aftermarket brand if it had already been replaced.

Don't forget to check the variator air intake filter also
 
#16 ·
Well I put that belt on there brand new about 4500 miles ago when I bought it since I had no history on when it was changed so it shouldn't be that I hope. I will try to take it apart again this weekend and see if I feel any rough spots on the channels they slide in. I put the rollers back in for right now though.

Thanks for the tips, I will check it all out this weekend.
 
#15 ·
Bolzen, you just said it. That filter needs to be kept clean if you are using sliders. It's dirt usually that causes them to 'stick' and flip. Also, any rough spots in the channels where the weights slide. That's all. I remember a post from Chris (Daboo) who says he uses a dry lube in the variator to keep a smooth action and he also made sure there were no rough spots of any kind in the slid channels. He had no problems as far as I know.
 
#17 ·
Oh this just keeps getting better, since I just can't give up on those sliders I put them back in last night and stripped the variator nut tightening with the impact wrench :(

Gotta go by Ace Hardware on my way home this afternoon and get one and put it back together tonight. Just thankful the threads on the shaft weren't damaged.
 
#18 ·
Guess I am forking over some car rental money next week because nobody around me sells M18 sized nuts. M16 to M20 is the jump, but no 18's. Figures they'd use some freak size you can't buy anywhere :(
 
#22 ·
The longer nut is actually better, although in this case it doesn't make any difference since threads are left unused anyways. Looks good, like a SS grade :cool: . However this nut will unlikely be screwed already -- shaft threads will instead. ;)

Too bad you discontinued the sliders, although heavy weight is not my favorite and i would probably prefer rollers to 'em also.
 
#23 ·
I didn't think about it being stronger than the threads on the shaft. I guess when the proper but from Babbitts gets here in a few weeks I will keep it and use it at the next belt change. I would try sliders again but the keep flipping and I am tired of taking the bike a part over and over again to fix them.

Does look pretty massive on there :)
 
#24 ·
While i agree that sliders can flip, on the other hand something has to cause this move. I.e. the problem root is rather not in sliders, but somewhere else. When cleaning remember also to remove dust from covers and adjacent areas.

I wouldn't worry so much about nut, the fins look requiring more attention.
 
#25 ·
Oh you think that broken fin is going to cause some other issues?
It was like that when I got it but since it was just one I didn't think much about it, but I can order a replacement if it's going to cause problems.

With my work schedule I just don't have time to figure it out but I will. I don't see how they are flipping either. I was originally worried because of the 7000rpms it was doing on the freeway but this forum has me convinced that the bike is not being harmed by that. I hope that's true because I do a good ammount of freeway riding.

I appreciate all the advise I get here so much.
 
#26 ·
Size difference in the nuts, the M18 size is hard to find in anystore, but now i have a bag of 10 lol, so if anyone every strips theirs and needs one ASAP just let me know LMAO!!!!

As you can see, I stripped the heck out of this one, not a bit of threads left in it :(


 
#27 ·
This is just a thought, I wonder if the missing fin is causing enuff imbalance to make the sliders flip. :scratch::scratch::?::?:
 
#29 ·
Wow I never thought about that, can I just replace the front plate or should both be replaced as a set? Maybe I will order them and replace them sometime soon and put the sliders back in.
 
#31 ·
The tan colored things are spacers right, 4 of them?
I will try to find some of that dry lube you all were talking about. Is that what I should use on those spacers, and in the channels?
 
#33 ·
Questions x 3

I too apparently have some flipped sliders. No high revving in town, but the highway revs - way too high for the 21 gram sliders.

What I want to know is this:

1. What's the best way to clean the sliders and the channels - sometimes any gunk in there is really hard to remove. I've found that I tend to get gunk when I use a lube, even the one Daboo recommended.

2. When folks say dry lube, there are several formulas that are contained in the spray lubes that will dry. What's the best formula to use?

3. Mileage wise it's time to change the belt, but if I measure its width, it's still way within specs. Could the belt be causing the problem? These belts are expensive so I hate to just change it for the sake of changing it (since I'm not touring anymore and I just mainly go around town now). What's the opinion of going ahead and changing it at around 14,500 or just leaving it on (after a good cleaning out of the variator) as long as the belt is within width specs?
 
#35 ·
1. Gunk it is, or brake cleaner or another solvent will do as long as you don't touch #4s.
2. I use MolyDry from Henkel, and though sliders didn't flip, mess was there as film came off the plate #6 along the slider paths. I didn't lube sliders themselves 'cause they are self lubricating and have poor adhesion (that's why they slide :) ). But main point of lubricating is just an extra glide -- for the flipping sliders it will hardly do any good.
3. If belt doesn't have cracks and retained elasticity there's no point in changing it.
 
#34 ·
I think it would be good idea to solve the problems with sliders by getting details of what year scooter/ burgman weight of sliders and their part number and weight of rider and passenger if any. Also if any lube is used and if the item 6 has had sharp edge removed.
when we see all this info in a format we can see a trend and identify the root cause.
I feel we are not getting the complete picture.
Hopefully the administrators can set something up to make it easy to get the data also we need to keep it only for those who actually had failure, not hearsay stories.
 
#36 ·
I've found any product with PTFE in it and that does not contain any oils or grease is fine. In the Uk we have a product called GT85. It is rich in PTFE and when applied to any area it dries leaving the PTFE in situ. Being totally dry it does not attract dirt but does add to the slideability of everything. Shake the can well before applying.
 
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