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Welcome to the BurgmanUSA forums Rob. Glad to have you join us.
 

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rob said:
Hi everyone,

I came across some more 05 photos from Europe somewhere...
Burgmania is a pretty good site with a really good name. They're based in Poland.

That series of three photos showing the bike head-on really does a good job of showing the range of motion of the new electric windscreen.
 

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Noticed on this site too:
http://www.burgmania.net/index.php
Pictures of a BMW scooter 850cc, looking very Burgman like.
Also a Silverwing with airbag.

Can't read Polish.
Is this for real, or someones wish list?
 

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lilleyen said:
Noticed on this site too:
http://www.burgmania.net/index.php
Pictures of a BMW scooter 850cc, looking very Burgman like.
Also a Silverwing with airbag.

Can't read Polish.
Is this for real, or someones wish list?
As near as I can figure:

It says the BMW 850 was conceived in 2002, but was delayed by the BMW C1 project; and that it was kept secret so as not to tip BMW's hand to the Japanese. Then it said it is in development and scheduled for release in 2008.


It says the Silverwing with the airbag is an experiment or concept that Honda did in 2004, and that while Honda is keeping it a big secret, they (Burgmania) think we may see it on the road soon.
 

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Thanks for the pics Rob. I can't seem to stop drooling :D
 

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Stormsteed said:
Brian said:
....It says the Silverwing with the airbag is an experiment or concept that Honda did in 2004, and that while Honda is keeping it a big secret, they (Burgmania) think we may see it on the road soon.
OK, is it just me? I can't really see how an airbag on a 2-wheeled open-air vehicle without seatbelts would provide any safety improvement at all... :?:
Maybe it has a seatbelt too :p
 

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Stormsteed said:
OK, is it just me? I can't really see how an airbag on a 2-wheeled open-air vehicle without seatbelts would provide any safety improvement at all... :?:
Might give yer nuts a soft landing as you commence the triple somersault! :lol:
 

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Hi Rob
Welcome to the forum :hello2:
Good link to the polish site good piccies just a shame we have no polish speakers here to translate for us.
Keep 'em coming!
 

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NormanB said:
Might give yer nuts a soft landing as you commence the triple somersault! :lol:
That might be true ... except Anya doesn't have any. :wink:
 

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NormanB said:
just a shame we have no polish speakers here to translate for us.
You can always try one of the online translators. Though I've not had very good results using one from Polish to English.

English to Polish
 

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billmeek said:
NormanB said:
Might give yer nuts a soft landing as you commence the triple somersault! :lol:
That might be true ... except Anya doesn't have any. :wink:
Harsh but true - sorry! :shock:
 

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Stormsteed said:
OK, is it just me? I can't really see how an airbag on a 2-wheeled open-air vehicle without seatbelts would provide any safety improvement at all... :?:
It's been shown that front airbags on cars and trucks don't really provide any advantage over seatbelts and shoulder harnesses (assumming the latter are worn), and can actually be dangerous in some circumstances. That is why the law was changed in the US and you can now have airbags removed legally. (Side-curtain airbags, on the otherhand, can greatly reduce head injuries from stiking the windows in side-on collissions.)

On a motorcycle, where there are no seatbelts, a front airbag of proper design could hold you in place in a forward collision. Somersaulting over the handlebars and flying into a fixed object at 60+ MPH can be hazardous to your health. Head and neck injuries, even when wearing a helmet, are the leading causes of death and disability in motorcycle crashes. Far better to stay with the bike, and let its mass protect you.

If you look at the picture of the Silverwing, you'll see that its airbag has sort of an upside-down wedge shape. This would press down on your thighs and hold your chest and head from hitting the handlebars/windshield.

Seems like a good idea if they can make it work.
 

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Stormsteed said:
OK, is it just me? I can't really see how an airbag on a 2-wheeled open-air vehicle without seatbelts would provide any safety improvement at all... :?:
Storm, I tend to agree.

  • 1. We've all seen bikes wipe out on turns and continue sliding far beyond the point where the rider is back on his feet and dusting himself down.
    2. The worst injuries usually come when the rider is dragged along wedged under the machine.
    3. Without a crumple zone it would probably be a bad idea to be connected to the bike in a collision situation
    - The crumple zone of a car acts to dissipate the energy and transmit less to passengers of the vehicle.
    - The front forks alone don’t provide enough dissipation of energy to cushion the blow.
    - They are not designed with that in mind as the market demands lighter and more powerful bikes, as opposed to heavier, safer bikes.
The other challenge with air bags is:

  • 1. In the automotive world, they have been shown to be dangerous for smaller occupants, especially when seatbelts are not worn.
    2. There are numerous different riding positions on a big-scooter with a variety of different rider body types (5ft nothings to 6ft5ins), so there would be no 'one size fits all'.
    3. They'd have to manufacture different airbags for different markets, which would begin to increase costs - this runs against their current drive to manufacture world bikes wherever possible.
Honda are keen to push the boundaries with regards to safety with motorcycles (CBS, ABS) so I would be interested to see their case for air-bags moving forwards. This is their current line-up of protective clothing inserts, etc:
Google translation of Honda Riding Gear

Speaking of seat belted motorcycles; the C1/C2 to my mind didn't successfully prove its safety concept. Seatbelts and little lips on the side of the machine won’t stop you putting a leg or arm out, and having it torn off as it gets trapped under the machine as it slides along on its side after a collision – with you stuck inside. Best off the machine in a collision.

Perhaps the best air-bag solution has already been found:
http://www.hit-air.com/english/main.html
 

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lycheed said:
...2. The worst injuries usually come when the rider is dragged along wedged under the machine.
On what do you base this statement.

As a former Emergency Medical Technician, among other things, I have been taught that the most severe injuries experienced by motorcycle crash victims are head and neck injuries.
 

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This is largely based on my club racing experience. I perhaps should have written something like "we've all seen racers wipe out on turns at the circuit" as I was really referring to circuit related non-collision induced injuries. It was the clearest example I could think of that demonstrated how much further a motorcycle will travel on it's side than a fallen rider.

Head and spinal injuries are usually sustained in collisions with other vehicles or road furniture, and are also typically fatal or result in severely impaired movement. I would agree that these are the 'most severe' injuries a rider can sustain, although people can loose limbs when dragged along under motorcycles once they are on their side.

For this reason, at the circuit you are advised to get away from the bike as soon as possible once fallen, as all that inertia+200kgs+moving parts has a devastating effect on the human body. Of course, on the circuit you don't have to worry about tarmac surfing into a curb/post/car - no such luck on the road. Low-siding on a mountain bend on cold tyres at -5 C at 25mph 14 months ago, I watched my 1100 slide right past me and into a concrete walled ditch. If I had been connected to that bike by a seatbelt or similar contraption and dragged into the ditch with it, I would either be dead or unable to walk now. 230kgs+concrete=somewhat extreme pain and serious injury. Better off away from the bike.
 
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