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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Well there are good days and there are bad days...

I was fresh from my GPS Hardwire install success last night, when I decided to tackle the final drive oil change on the 400 today. I've never attempted it, but the videos and manual seem straight forward. NOT!

I got down to removing the actual CVT cover and it wouldn't budge. At all. Nada, nothing, not even a wiggle. Couldn't get even a thin screwdriver in to break the seal.

I watched Micbergsma video on how to remove stuborn CVT covers and even he was struggling with it. He had to time lapse the sequence. Something about the bearing getting stuck inside.

Well, lacking proper tools, facilities, knowledge and strength, I did what most men of some means do. Buttoned her up and taking it to the shop next chance I get. I'll get the clutch deglazed while its in there.

But, I've never read on this forum of anyone having problems changing the final drive oil on the 400. I read advice on the 650s on occasion, but never in the 400. Do people even do it on the 400? Or even know about it? Its really buried down in there. Out of sight, out of mind.

I must confess I was somewhat ignorant to this elusive little 1/3 of a quart of oil enigma. Is there a trick or tool the professionals use to pull the cover off? My mechanic seems to get it all tore down in 15 minutes.

I'm interested to know how many people actually do it, at what intervals, professional or DiY, etc. Also, are there any 400 owners scratching there heads, pulling out their owners manual, and thinking "final drive oil?"
 

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Take 2 long metric bolts and screw them into the CVT cover towards the rear of the cover. Run them in evenly, and it pushes, or pulls it off when the bolts touch and press internally. Wish I knew the bolt measurements, sorry.
 

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I watched Micbergsma video on how to remove stuborn CVT covers and even he was struggling with it. He had to time lapse the sequence. Something about the bearing getting stuck inside.
The cited video is the only one of his I have been disappointed in. The proper, quick and easy to remove the inner cover is to run a couple of 8x1.25/50 bolts into the two threaded holes located just above and below the centerline of the clutch. Remove all the other bolts, seat the two mentioned and run each down a half turn or so at a time. As you do, give the front of the cover a few taps and it will work out, as well. Before long, you're there! You may see the bearing still on the clutch shaft. It shouldn't be there and, that's the problem people have talked about. If that happens, turning the cover over you'll see that the two little retainers that normally hold the bearing in the case have become bent. Use a puller to remove the bearing from the shaft, noting which way it faces. Use some emory paper to clean up the inner race of the bearing and the shaft, being sure the bearing easily slides on. Remove the two retainers. Grease the bearing and put it in the case. You may be able to straighten out and salvage the clips without breaking them. I was and others have not. In that case, you'll have to acquire new ones. Reinstall them and, after doing everything else you intend to do, things are ready to go back together. Once you've made this fix, you're likely to not need to do it again provided, you do regular maintenance and the bike does not sit a long time.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Wish something would have mentioned the two bolts thing. The manual just says to remove the cover, like it should just fall off.

Oh well, the more you know. Next time I suppose.
 

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Is the clutch out already? I'm hoping for mine to last 50-100k considering I do mostly interstate riding.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Wish someone would've read the forum more :)
I read the forum every day and I don't remember the subject being broached in the last nine months. Which is why I brought it up.

We repeat much of the same information many, many, many times over for new members. Blip the 400s clutch to 4500 rpm on take off, yes the seat s.cks, the clutch needs to be deglazed, etc, etc, almost weekly.

Considering the amount of work to be done in the CVT area... belt, rollers, deglazing, final drive oil change, etc., I thought it a subject that may need repeating at least once a year.

Searching the old threads is fine, but sometimes you don't know what you don't know, until its too late, as was my case. I certainly would have researched the subject had it even been on my radar. In fact, I probably wouldn't have undertaken the task had I read warnings on the board. I know my mechanical limitations.

So if would be 400 mechanics learn a little trick or warning from my obvious ignorance, good. I will consider this a win.

I think Chappy did. :D
http://burgmanusa.com/forums/12-general-discussion/82097-classic-400-highly-recommended.html
 

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Hey Liam, I recently did my first CVT tune up a few weeks ago. Somehow, I figured out how to take the clutch cover off by watching the video AND reading a couple of different threads and triangulating the information. Looking forward to getting proper tools for the clutch and variator removal, though. Also, I forgot to de-glaze the inside of the clutch bell, so a tiny bit of shudder/squeal has returned.

Feels good to be able to do the work.
 

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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
Hey Liam, I recently did my first CVT tune up a few weeks ago. Somehow, I figured out how to take the clutch cover off by watching the video AND reading a couple of different threads and triangulating the information. Looking forward to getting proper tools for the clutch and variator removal, though. Also, I forgot to de-glaze the inside of the clutch bell, so a tiny bit of shudder/squeal has returned.

Feels good to be able to do the work.
Ya, I might try it again, with this new found wisdom. I watched videos, read the manual to and there was nothing I saw to warn me of my impending failure. I really don't have the proper facilities or tool set for anything but minor maintenance. I don't even have a garage (converted into an extra room long ago). Not even a shade tree. It's all done under the hot CA sun on black asphalt. My driveway isn't even level (we live on the side of a hill).

So more than likely, I'll just take it to the shop. It's down the street from where I work and the clutch needs deglazing anyway. They need the business and I've slightly more money than sense.
 

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Check out the knowledge base talks about this http://burgmanusa.com/bkb/400+b+Trans+Oil+Change

Btw unless you need to remove the clutch Don't worry about the bearing if it stays on. Shaft, as seen on the kb article

My previous owner removed it, damaged it, then forced it in the cover and it doesn't just slide in, cracked the cvt cover doing it and cost me money to replace the cover and bearing.

If you do need to remove it, I found a bearing tool at hf that drives it evenly and doesn't crack the cover or damage the bearing
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
It's that case cracking, clip breaking, and "cost me money" talk that warns me off of such endeavors. It's good to know ones limits and when to seek a professional.

I've a state-issued professional license in my occupation and don't recommend the uninitiated to try my vocation. Why would I deny the certified mechanics of this world the same respect? My local guy is very good.

thanks everyone for the support. But as the humorist sign I've seen in many MC shops says... Labor rates go up if the customer worked on it first. :rolleyes:
 

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I read the forum every day and I don't remember the subject being broached in the last nine months. Which is why I brought it up.
Yeah, this is a problem with forums organization -- the information even many times duplicated is scattered far and wide. This is one of the concise clutch writeup, but somebody with authorization can make most important threads sticky. Then it would be easier to find and add on instead of starting a new one every time.
 

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Liam, next time you want to work on your scooter, let me know and you can come over to my place. I have a garage we can work in. I'm also, gradually, gathering a set of scooter tools.
 

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Guys i will join you then to make it three :D I've got a couple of handy tools also
 

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Wish something would have mentioned the two bolts thing. The manual just says to remove the cover, like it should just fall off.

Oh well, the more you know. Next time I suppose.
Had the same issue (documented extensively with pictures on a Post on here).

Ended up getting it pried off (Thin bladed knife, to thin screw driver, to larger screw driver, to chisel). Finally got it out to about 1/4 inch and then it wiggled off.

When I went back to my post (after all the prying, etc.), there was an answer (use screws). I did not wait for an answer after I described the problem and went on with the prying.

Darn lucky I did not break something. I did destroy the gasket (been using painter tape, blue tape, for a gasket material).

Anyway, it was and is all documented with pictures.

BY THE WAY - Next time (4000 miles later) it just pulled off. I did put some bearing greese (light coat) on the shaft and bearing before reinstalling the first time. Might be better to use anti-sieze
 

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Check out the knowledge base talks about this http://burgmanusa.com/bkb/400+b+Trans+Oil+Change

Btw unless you need to remove the clutch Don't worry about the bearing if it stays on. Shaft, as seen on the kb article

My previous owner removed it, damaged it, then forced it in the cover and it doesn't just slide in, cracked the cvt cover doing it and cost me money to replace the cover and bearing.

If you do need to remove it, I found a bearing tool at hf that drives it evenly and doesn't crack the cover or damage the bearing
That is an interstiong one --- Bearing came out attached to the shaft?

Glad I did not have that probelm or break something with my prying. LUCKY, I was.

Bearing stayed in the case and shaft pulled out of the bearing. Also, did not bend the clips that hold the bearing in the case. LUCKY - I was.

As far as he metal gasket, damaged mine (said in last post) and used Painter Masking Tape (blue) to make a gasket. Taped it around the case, then cut to fit with an Exacto (sp) Knife (take your time cutting around the holes where the screws go thru).

It would seem very hard to hold that flimsy metal gasket in place while installing the cover anyway. I tried - but mine also had a wrinkle in it that I could not flatten out. So, I tried the painters tape (read about that on this Forum also).
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Liam, next time you want to work on your scooter, let me know and you can come over to my place. I have a garage we can work in. I'm also, gradually, gathering a set of scooter tools.
Hey thanks, BRC. Nice offer. Might take you up on it someday.

But I think I'll take it over to Nawaz (local Suzuki dealer). It's a good shop and he could use the business. He helps me out from time to time. I like to repay good customer service.
 

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Ya, I might try it again, with this new found wisdom. I watched videos, read the manual to and there was nothing I saw to warn me of my impending failure. I really don't have the proper facilities or tool set for anything but minor maintenance. I don't even have a garage (converted into an extra room long ago). Not even a shade tree. It's all done under the hot CA sun on black asphalt. My driveway isn't even level (we live on the side of a hill).

So more than likely, I'll just take it to the shop. It's down the street from where I work and the clutch needs deglazing anyway. They need the business and I've slightly more money than sense.
Liam, actually you only lacked the bolts to do the job. Very few tools needed. Future tip: you can use the lower exhaust silencer bolts to insert into the transmission cover to release it. Leave the top bolt in place to hold the silencer safely in place. It's very easy to do once you know. I sympathise with your plight...but now you know!
 

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Liam
Why didn't you PM me. With 46k+ on my 07 400 before I sold it I pulled it off many a time. I still have the bolts I used. Don't have a need for them anymore. PM me with your address & I'll send them to you FREE!
As far as the oil change time 10k is what I used on the 400 & the 650.
 
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