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Discussion Starter #1
Ok, after a few days of seat time got a few gripes when comparing the 650 to the 400. I'm leaving out the obvious complaints, most I was already expecting (engine brake (which I actually like), cvt engagement, width, etc..)

These are all minor pedly things, well, mostly. And I'm sure with time I'll get over them and look back and be like... that was an issue? but for now....

With the 400, I could put like one leg back underneath me, almost like a sport bike, to give my leg a different position and stretch it a different way. When doing this I was using the 'slope' up to the passenger foot rest to put my feet on. The position of the 650's "leg tunnel" prevents this since its slightly further back.

Side stand is to far forward, I keep kicking open air when trying to put it down. On 400 I used the arch of my foot to put it down, on the 650, I'm using my tippy toes. I understand why since most of the weight is more forward. I just don't like it lol

Not sure if its just me imagining things, but it seems the handle bars are more V'd inward than they need to be. Rather than having my hands/wrist in a relaxing position, i have to king of tweak them 'outward' to grasp the bars. I might of had to do this on the 400 and not noticed, but I'm definitely noticing it on the 650.

The trunk's liner on the 400's IMHO is nicer, it was a nice carpet-type liner. The 650's felt-type liner leaves much to be desired.

Gotta look 'down' at the mirrors. This is a big one for me to get used to. With the 400's they are in your line-of-sight, so its easy to check them without much head movement, with the 650's you need to physically move head down sometimes to see them (especially if wearing full face helmet).

Buttons, lots of buttons. I'm fumbling around with my left thumb trying to find the turn signal switch. I have no clue how Gold Wing riders manage to use theirs :D.

Dash... prefer analog gauges, but I know alot of people here do too.

That's about it so far. Again, small things, nothing major, just little qwerks to get used to.
 

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After riding my 650 for a thousand miles after leaving my 400, I have found a couple of things I still dislike and have not really adjusted to. I don't like the mirrors and I don't like the digital dash. The 400 has a much better instrument panel. I don't like choosing between time or temperature and I don't like having MPH or mileage.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
The time or temperature I'm kinda meh on, if anything, I can sence how hot/cold it is, so time is alot more important to me. Although would be nice for it to show the trip and the efficiency at the same time. Seems there is alot of room on the lower bar to be able to do this. My main is the dash in regards to the vital info, speed and RPM's. I, like most people, prefer the analog.
 

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The mirrors were a selling point for me. Not a fan of having a 'lollipop' on the handlebars. Love being able to just fold them in so nothing snags on 'em-flip 'em back out, and away ya go. No need to re-adjust 'em. Now, if the bars could just be an inch or two shorter......
 

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I found no fault with the mirrors on my 09 and 11 650s. The mirrors on the 2013 are (to me) much better. They give me a better view of what is behind me. I too like an analog dash but on the 2013 analog dash I find the RPM and speedometer are hard to see in dark, cloudy rainy days. I think the reason being is that there is no light behind them in the daytime. They do light up good in the night time. Will have to find the sensor that keeps them turned off in the daytime.

Bill
 

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you are going to enjoy the 650 a lot once you get passed the initial ownership period and getting to know the ride phase, hang in there.

I personally prefer having the mirrors on the body of the bike vs the handlebars, you still have to take your eyes off the road to check the mirrors no matter where they are mounted.
 

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One thing I like about having the mirrors on the body is they are more usable when turning while backing up. When I am on my 400 and backing up I can't see directly behind when I turn the handlebars. The mirrors are pointing with the front wheel not the bike. On the 650 the mirrors are pointed where the bike is going so I can see what is directly behind me.

That is especially useful when I am turning the bike around in the garage. I'm doing a tight 3 point turn and need to know how close I am to the wall. On the 400 I have to stop and straighten the front wheel to point the mirror so I can see. On the 650 I just watch the mirror and keep moving.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
I think my major complaint with the mirrors is just the looking down part. With the 400's mounted up high, I could scan my field of view and include the mirrors too, like in a car. With the 650, i have to tilt head downwards. Its not really a matter of 'taking eyes off road', its more a matter of tilting head down to see them.

I'm sure I'll learn to enjoy them, just getting used too.

And one more gripe... suspension is alot more cushier on the 400 than the 650's. I even adjusted the rears down to 1 and its still a little harsh on the lovely roads we have around here. Guess this is why I see alot of suspension modification threads on here.

And Buffalo (posted same time i was typing :p ) I find, for me, the exact opposite, I kinda liked how on the 400 I could 'turn' the mirrors. This comes into play when pulling out into traffic, as I can see behind me quicker with the mirrors alighigned with the wheels, rather than waiting for the body itself to swing around straight. I kind of did this today while pulling out, wanted to take a quick glance behind me to make sure I was accelerating fast enough for the oncoming traffic, but had to 'wait' for body to swing around. Granted, this time period is only a fraction of a second, but hey, what I was used too.
 

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The observed differences are more aligned with muscle conditioning... e.g. the side stand and the muscle movements used to kick the stand down, which differ between the Burgy 400 to that of the 650 is as much about muscle memory and conditioning... same as the method and movements required to use/view the mirrors between the 400 to the location of the mirrors of the 650. Actually one doesn't really need to move ones head at all to view the 650 mirrors, since one just needs to use eye movements (try just moving ones eyes while maintaining head positioning), again this comes back to fine muscle movements, and having to retrain and relearn muscles (adaptation).

For seating position etc, move oneself fore or aft on the seat as much as one would move the legs... on occasion I even pop my feet (with boots on [ATGATT]) on the pillion foot rests, then hoist my arse onto the riders bum buttrest, just for a change. Handlebar orientation and reach will differ markedly between one rider and another, we're all slightly anatomically unique, some with longer arms, short torso's and then there are those with the opposite configuration. Personally I much prefer the bars on both my Burgys K3 & K7 versus the bars of say my CF650TR (650TK)... though I also like the bars and the positioning of the same on my BMW K1, Dragstar XVS1100, and XT1200Z... but there are some riders/owners who complain about the bars, hand grips et al., on the other forums I frequent... for these same bikes...
As for preferences and opinions of LCD vz-a-vz analogue displays etc., just like an anus - everyone's got one (no offence intended).

I move between one of many bikes and it takes a few minutes sometimes, to adapt to the subtle differences between one ride versus another. I sometimes go out for a 300km ride, then arriving back home to the garage put the ride away (usually this is my daily ride 650K7 exec) then throw a leg over a different ride, turn key, blip starter button, and off I go for another 100-300km ride (local mountains and lakes nearby), adjustment takes a minute then all good to go. Often, even though I'm enjoying the other ride, the convenience, comfort and fun factor of the Burgy 650 comes to the fore, and I realise at that point all that I miss about them Lardy's.

YMMV.
 

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Your commute is 300 km/day? Wow, impressive.

The Big Burg makes a VERY strong case as the best all-rounder, to the point that it's hard to choose another motorcycle. Even gravel roads seem more stable with the King on my side.

The mirrors remain to me the BEST on any bike I've ever tried. They show the road behind you, instead of your elbows. I never thought about folding mirrors until the Burg--darn handy.

You'll probably need to address the suspension a bit, TDC. Sonic springs, 15w oil and some Hagons are the most cost effective option. $300ish bucks and you're set. Racetech GV emulators are a bit of a luxury--they add a bit more control but I'm not convinced they're worth it (at least for the Burg). I tried both included valve springs and different tension settings, but it didn't change much.
 

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I think my major complaint with the mirrors is just the looking down part. With the 400's mounted up high, I could scan my field of view and include the mirrors too, like in a car. With the 650, i have to tilt head downwards. Its not really a matter of 'taking eyes off road', its more a matter of tilting head down to see them.

I'm sure I'll learn to enjoy them, just getting used too.
If in time you don't adjust to the mirrors, you do have other options. Some members have added a top plate with longer screws to the brake reservoirs and added stalk mirrors to that. I chose to add mirrors to my shield to help eliminate blind spots. Having an Exec. I can raise or lower them, however Being vertically challenged I tend to leave it down, and therefore in hindsight I wish I had mounted them about 3-4 inches higher.
http://www.saeng.com/product.php?id=253
 

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Re: side stand

As the owner of both a 400 and 650, all I can say is "I kick a lot of air."
 

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Re: side stand

As the owner of both a 400 and 650, all I can say is "I kick a lot of air."
I did the same thing initially on my 650 but it became simple when I figured out it works well if you use your toe to deploy it. I didn't figure it out when I had my 400 so I don't know if it works on them.
 
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