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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
When my 650 was new, and in stock configuration, I got 51 mpg on one tankful of gas, and typically 47 or 48 mpg. I now typically get 44 mpg, and only got 42 mpg on one tank when I was "performance testing" my new Remus exhaust cannister.

I think the big XXL Clearview screen cost me a couple mpg, due to increased wind resistance, and the Remus exhaust seemed to cause another drop of about 2 mpg. I'm not sure if the big E52 Givi trunk had an effect or not (possible additional wind drag & weight, but I don't see it causing more than a 1 mpg drop, if that). I need the windscreen, and I really like the exhaust, and I use the trunk on every ride, so I guess I just have to pay at the pump. What is annoying with a 4 gallon fuel tank is the decreased range between gas stops. I get the 1 bar on the gas gauge and the flashing fuel pump logo at about 136 miles now.

I had a weird eye opener today. I took my 1000cc, 90+ hp, V-Strom for a 200 mile ride. I left the side cases at home, but I did have the trunk mounted. I do have the tallest Cee Bailey windscreen and Remus exhaust cannisters on the V-Strom, so it was configured similar to the scooter. Conditions were very good. I cruised at 70 mph (indicated) on country 2 lanes - no traffic most of the way. No wind (rare for Nebraska). Slowed down once in a while to pass through small towns, but very little stop & go. Terrain was gently rolling hills, but rarely required dropping below 6th gear. I filled up at 160 miles, and I knew I'd done well because I still had 3 bars showing on the gas gauge (5.8 gallon tank). 52 mpg! Better than I've ever gotten with the AN650.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Silver said:
That V-Strom 1000 is looking better to me all the time. I'm gearing up for a purchase in the spring and I love what I've heard from that versatile machine.
The DL1000 V-Strom is one of the better motorcycles I've owned. The DL650 is also getting great press, and there are already a lot of happy owners. There is a similar forum to this one at http://www.stromtrooper.com/forum/index.php. It is useful, but doesn't get as much message traffic as BurgmanUSA.

I ride the AN650 more frequently than the DL1000, but today was a perfect V-Strom day - I couldn't resist.

Typically, I get about 42 mpg with the V-Strom. I think the fact that there was no wind today helped mileage out a lot - and I only had two passes where I exceeded 100 mph. :wink: Mostly I was content to cruise along at 70 mph. I was still amazed at the 52 mpg.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
gruntled said:
I suspect the trunk is costing you more than you think. I learned long ago that a trunk is like dragging an anchor.
You are probably right. Of course the V-Strom had a trunk on it today also, but it is a little smaller than the E52 Givi on the Burgman.

What I'm wondering about is the Remus exhaust. I don't remember taking a mileage hit when I put Remus cannisters on the V-Strom. It is quite possible that I hadn't checked mileage since installing the XXL Clearview on the Burgman, which I did just a week before I installed the Remus. So maybe the big Clearview is the real culprit.

Anyway, I am spoiled now from the comfort zone I get riding behind the XXL shield, and I also use the Givi trunk constantly to store my riding gear when I stop anywhere. Comfort and utility override mileage for me I guess.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Stormsteed said:
gruntled said:
I suspect the trunk is costing you more than you think. I learned long ago that a trunk is like dragging an anchor.
I'm wondering if the side bags would be better than the trunk, in terms of wind resistance...?
Good thought, but I think not. The side cases on a V-Strom stick WAY out from the sides of the motorcycle. On some other machines with more streamined cases tucked in tighter to the bike - you could be right.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
gary.b

Did you add the Givi screen between these tests - after the first or 2nd test where you were 50+ mpg?

I only got 43 mpg when I filled up today. I think the big XXL Clearview screen is one of the main reasons that my mileage has dropped. The Givi would have a similar affect I'd think.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Ted White said:
pauljo:

I think you had the best of the worlds going for you on that VStrom ride. Both bikes weigh about the same, you had a windless day, long rural roads, hardly any stops or passes.

Your 1000cc engine is loafing at anything under 100mph (I've got about 6 hours on a VStrom, don't ask me how I know about speeds over 100mph). At 70, the 650 isn't being pushed by any means, but it does have to work a bit harder, especially with that big windscreen.
Ted,

Yes it was an absolutely perfect ride for the V-Strom. It is rare to catch a day here where the wind is still for one thing. And I left with a full tank of gas that I had no prior in-town mileage on. But 52 miles per gallon was still awesome for a machine that powerful. I could have danced a jig around the gas pump! Incidentally, the AN650 is 65 lbs heavier than the DL1000 (going by Suzuki's dry weight specs).

After I filled the tank, traffic picked up a bit and I had to make a couple of passes... Each time, I was going more than 115 mph at the end of the pass - and still accellerating rapidly. (Those darn cattle trucks are pretty long.) On the same pass, the AN650 would have reached maybe 95 mph and would be starting to breathe pretty hard. So if you exceeded 100 mph on a V-Strom, I am sure it was quite unintentional. :wink:

Can you imagine opening up a Hayabusa for the same pass distance? Probably be doing 150 mph and still accellerating like a jet plane.... That's more adrenalin than I need to feel these days...
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Ted,

I just read it. I've never tried a sheepskin. But Allwalk's suggestion to trade it for a white one might work. It is certainly worth a try. Seems like black is the universal color for motorcycle seats... The dark blue on my custom upholstered seat probably isn't too much better for heat absorption, but we have only had one day in the nineties here since I had that done.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Randy said:
For those looking for better mpg don't for get your air cleaner. Don't know about the 650 but on the 400 a dirty filter will cost you several mpg's :(
Randy,

Good point. I did take a look at mine last week and it appeared to be pretty clean. I suppose there are some imbedded dust particles that aren't so obvious to the eye, but for now, I'll consider it to be in good shape.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Project Mileage...

OK, I'm going to try to figure out why my mileage dropped from 47-48 mph to 43 mpg.

This morning I took off the XXL Clearview windscreen and put the stock one back on. Gosh, I forgot how tiny it is. It looks like a sport windscreen compared to the big Clearview.

I removed the Givi trunk. I left the mounting rack in place because it is small and flush with the back of the seat.

I took the heavy and bulky stuff out of the underseat trunk. The CruzTools toolkit, the electric air pump, the Stop & Go tire repair kit, the fancy brass tire gauge, the rainsuit & raingloves, are now sitting on my workbench. I doubt that the weight of these items add up to much in terms of fuel mileage - but without the Givi trunk I needed more underseat storage space freed up.

I am basically back to stock configuration except for the Remus exhaust. (OK, there is the Pirelli rear tire and the Ikon shocks, but I don't see them as gas guzzling modifications.) I'll run through two or three tanks of gas and check mileage at each fillup. This should tell me if the Remus exhaust is affecting mileage.

I might just go ahead and order a new air filter from Ron Ayers too. Randy does have a point... Maybe then I'll do another tankful or two with a brand new air filter in place.

Then the Givi trunk will go back on for a couple of tankfuls.

If it turns out that the XXL Clearview is the main culprit, well, I should know be then if I can tolerate the stock screen after riding with it for close to 1000 miles...
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I did about 70 miles of test riding this evening. It was 90 degrees, very humid, and wind was gusting between 15 -25 mph.

Removing the Givi trunk and reverting to the stock tiny windscreen had a very noticable effect on performance. The 650 accellerates stronger, especially in that 70 - 95 mph range. I held the throttle open after one pass, and eventually saw 115 mph on the speedometer, which I figure is a true 103.5 mph. The machine could not do that with the big windscreen and trunk installed. Since performance is back to the original level, I suspect that fuel mileage will be also. I was throttle happy today, but I still think this tankful will return better than the 43 mpg I have been getting lately. Next tank, I will behave...

The wind hits my helmet at chin level now. No buffeting, but with the HJC full face the wind noise was awful. The visor would slam shut at about 40 mph and it was awfully hot in there. Went home and got my 3/4 helmet with drop down face shield. With that helmet, ventilation was more than enough to dissipate the heat, but it was still too noisy. Went home again and dug out my old Shoei RF-800 full face. This helmet was clearly the winner. Wind noise was greatly reduced. I could ride with the visor cracked open at just about any speed. It only has two vents (compared to five on the HJC) but they actually work...

The key to living with the short windscreen is going to be having a helmet that copes well with being fully in the windblast coming off the top of the windshield. The Shoei RF-800 is almost OK with that. I wonder if the newer RF-900 or RF-1000 models are worth looking at. I read one report in this months Rider magazine on the RF-1000. It stated that the RF-1000 is a lot lighter, but not quite as quiet as the RF-900. One reason I had retired the RF-800 is because it is quite heavy, and that would bother me on long rides.

The other drawback is that wind gusts from the side do bother more. The scooter will track just fine, but I was getting pushed around some, and that occasionally caused me to pull the machine off course a bit. I did not feel as confident when the wind got fiesty as I did behind the Clearview.

I can already see that this is going to be an interesting exercise. In the end, I wonder if I will opt for performance and mileage - or comfort and utility. Time will tell.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Ted,

I was very excited at the increase in performance yesterday. My 650 was starting to struggle at about 93 mph before, and sometimes could not hit an indicated 100 mph on level terrain. I don't make a habit of going over 100 mph on the scoot - but it appears that I gained back 15 to 20 mph in top speed, and that is a lot. More importantly, it has reasonable snap now for those higher speed 2-lane road passes.

I don't think the Remus pipe is the culprit at this point, which is good, because as you noted it would not be easy to revert to the stock cannister. I'll know for sure after I run through another tank of gas.

I bought all that contingency stuff over the Winter when I was snowbound. When I am out in the boondocks, it is nice to know I have it - but I hope I never really have to use the tire plugger kit. So now I am down to a can of fix-a-flat and a cell phone. I did pick up a set of Canyon Dancer tie downs the other day, and I am still carrying them. From what I understand, the Burgman isn't the easiest thing to tie down on a trailer or flatbed - and the Canyon Dancer setup works pretty good. Doesn't take up much space in the trunk either.

My theory at this point on windscreens is that the more air you are shoving aside, the more you are losing in performance and mileage. (There are probably some design efficiencies that can partially overcome that.) But if I am right, the Large Clearview you ordered won't be as disruptive to performance as the XXL. Heck, I was still getting 47 mpg with the old style XL Clearview & the Givi Trunk. But the new style XXL is much wider, as well as taller.

I think I'll go see if I can find a Shoei RF-1000 at a dealership today and look it over. It appears that the RF-900 is out of production now. You are right - dealing with the accellerated wind blast coming off of the top of a windshield is a lot tougher for a helmet than if it were fully in the wind on a naked bike. But on the scooter you really need at least enough windscreen to take the wind pressure off of your chest due to the upright seating position.
 

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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
This first tank of gas already had 5 or 6 miles on it with the big windscreen and trunk still on the scooter. I also rode pretty hard yesterday, testing performance without regard to economy - including one run up to 115 mph. After doing another 65 miles this morning, I filled up at the 140 mile mark.

I wasn't expecting a lot, but hoped it would be a little better than the 43 mpg I had been averaging. I got 48 mpg!!!

I'll try to restrain my throttle hand a bit on this next tank and see what I get. But I think it's already safe to say that the Remus pipe was not responsible for my drop in mileage...
 

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Discussion Starter · #22 ·
Shoei Helmet & stock windscreen

In my tests yesterday I noticed that my old Shoei RF-800 was much quieter than my other helmets when riding behind the short stock windscreen. The problem with the Shoei is that it is an XL size - and I really should have an XXL. So I can wear it for a couple of hours OK, but any longer than that and I tend to get a headache. It is also a bit heavy.

Last night I checked a bunch of websites, and everybody is selling the new Shoei RF-1000. It appeared that the RF-900 is discontinued.

I stopped in at my dealer while out riding this morning. They had a new RF-1000 in the XXL size. But they also had a residual supply of RF-900s, including an XXL. Both XXLs were White (There was a Black RF-1000 also, but after the Ted White Sheepskin episode - I thought that the white color might reflect heat better.)

I compared the two helmets. I found that I preferred the older RF-900 design - it fit me better. So I dickered with the salesperson awhile, and ended up getting 25% off of their asking price. So I now own a white RF-900. I then got him to give me 10% off of a light grey tinted faceshield for the helmet.

I test rode the new helmet for about an hour. It fits comfortably, and wind noise is not bad - slightly reduced from the RF-800. There is no buffeting at all. The ventilation didn't seem to be any more effective than the RF-800's, even though it had been slightly redesigned.

The main thing I don't like is that there is a whistling noise that occurs when my head is pointed straight forward. If I cock my head slightly to the left or right, the whistle stops. I tried opening an closing the various vent controls, but that didn't get rid of it. Has anyone else experienced this? If so, is there a known way to get rid of it?
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
Results of my second tank of gas with the small windscreen and the Givi trunk removed - 51.9 mpg. Quite an improvement from 43 mpg!!! The best mileage I had previously gotten before starting with the add-ons and modifications was 51 mpg. So I'll say at this point that the Remus exhaust is definitely not adversely affecting gas mileage.

I filled up the tank and reinstalled the Givi trunk, and put all my contingency stuff back in the underseat trunk. I've added at least 20 to 25 pounds of weight by doing that, but I think the bigger question is whether the Givi trunk creates enough aerodynamic drag to significantly impact fuel mileage. I'm hoping for at least 48 mpg on this tank. If I get that, the Givi trunk will stay on.

I returned the Shoei RF-900 helmet for a full refund today. I could not deal with that loud whistle and the poor ventilation - the old RF-800 flows more air, doesn't whistle, and suppresses wind noise about the same as the newer model. I kept the new smoke color faceshield and put it on my RF-800. I looked at the newest Shoei RF-1000 again, but it simply won't work for me. They have changed the mold to fit the round head folks (like Arai helmets) and it doesn't fit my more oval head shape well at all.

I did about 100 miles this morning, wearing the RF-800. Not so bad. I'm actually doing OK with the tiny stock windscreen. I never thought I'd say that... And it looks pretty cool - sportier.

While I was at the dealership, I met a guy who was just about to purchase a Burgman 400. He has been monitoring our forum for information - but hasn't joined yet. After talking for awhile, he started leaning toward getting the 650 instead. I'm not sure what he eventually went for, but I think we have another Nebraska Burgman rider now. Both he and his wife were very pleasant.
 

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Discussion Starter · #27 ·
I rode 150 miles today, to get a mileage reading with the stock windscreen and the Givi trunk on the 650. A little in town, a little interstate, and a lot of country two lane with several vigorous passes - and three attempts at top speed on different roads. 51.4 mpg (versus 51.9 on the last tank with the short windscreen and no trunk, and no top speed attempts). I'd say that the half a mile per gallon drop was more due to the top speed attempts than the Givi trunk, so it does not seem to be hurting mileage at all.

What it did do, was knock a few mph off of top speed. At 106 mph I could feel a slight wobble develop, and at 108 mph - it was pretty much maxed out. I got 109 on one run, but it took a long time to get from 108 to 109. This compares to 115 mph (no wobble at all) without the trunk.

Acceleration was still good up to 100 mph - quite strong up to 95 or 96.

So the trunk doesn't hurt fuel mileage, but costs about 7 mph top end. Not a big price to pay for for almost doubling storage capacity, and giving me a convenient place to stow my helmet, jacket, gloves, etc. when I stop somewhere. It also provides another set of brake lights and improves the ride. The springs on the Ikon shocks are stiffer than the stock ones. The trunk adds some weight at the back that helps counteract the stiffer shocks - the ride was a bit harsher with the trunk off.

So for now, the trunk stays on, and so does the stock windscreen. I do not want to go back to the 43 mpg and loss of performance that the XXL Clearview was causing. 8 mpg times 4 gallons = 32 miles of additional range on a tank of gas.
 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
Just a side note on the windscreen experiment. On a two lane road, when you meet an oncoming big rig that is hauling along at 60 mph plus, you can get hit with a pretty awesome wind blast. If the wind is blowing across the road from the left (the far side of the truck), it seems to gather the wind up and hurl it at you. This is a fairly common thing to encounter in this area of the country.

With the bigger windscreens, it was like hitting a wall. The windscreen would flex on those rubber mounts a lot, and often the whole scooter would shudder. If I was riding with my visor open a little, it would invariably slam shut with a loud bang at the same time. I would kinda cringe when approaching an oncoming truck on a high speed two lane - because if the wind was blowing from the left, it was not going to be pleasant.

I've noticed the last few days, that the scooter with the smaller stock screen mounted, cuts through those "wind walls" much cleaner. You can feel the wind swirl around you as the truck passes, but the scooter doesn't shudder, the windscreen flexes less, and my visor even stays cracked open most of the time (it only got blown shut once today - and more gently than before).

Just another reason that I'm starting to like that teeny windscreen.
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Ted,

I've done this more times than I care to admit..

First, pull each of the four rubber nuts completely out of the retaining bracket. This can be a little tough, you have to kind of pull-twist-pull until you get them out.

Line up the windscreen over the mounting holes on the bracket. Take a
rubber nut and a screw. Put the screw into the rubber nut, but don't start to tighten it. Using the screw, push the rubber nut through the hole in the windscreen and the retaining bracket. (Pushing the screw will cause that bunched up hump in the rubber nut to straighten a little - and the nut will slide through the holes like magic.) Repeat for the other three nuts. Tighten the screws - get them nice and snug, but don't over torque them.

Other than putting that little front cover back on, you are done.
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
You don't need lubricant to reinsert them. Pushing on that screw works like magic - they slide right through. I'd avoid lubricants anyway, because some of them could cause the rubber to deteriorate.

I never thought about removing the bracket and pulling the nuts out from behind... Try it if you want to, and let us know if it works. You might be on to something.
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
Ted,

I had to do that so many times, that at one point I bought a set of spare rubber nuts from Ron Ayers. Just in case I wore the first set out...

I think I'd encourage you to try reinstalling the stock screen. The Clearview will be a bit bigger and heavier, so if you have your technique perfected you'll be ahead of the game. Just a thought.
 

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Discussion Starter · #38 ·
gary.b

Two lane country roads, in very sparsely populated areas - lots of those out here in Nebraska. Speed limits on them are typically 60 - 65 mph in Nebraska and Iowa. Once in awhile you might encounter a Sheriff, but they are not heavily patrolled. Traffic ranges from light to non-existant. Most folks drive them at 10 mph over the limit. I don't mess around when I encounter the occasional small town. They have speed zones that drop down to 35 mph, even 25 mph sometimes - but these speed zones only last for a mile or two. I keep my speed right on the mark around the towns. I also do not typically ride more than 10 mph (actual) over the limit out there. I will exceed that on a pass, but I slow down when the pass is complete, limiting my exposure.

But I was trying to determine some efficiencies here... and I don't have ready access to a racetrack, so I took advantage of a few stretches of rural road with long visibility and no traffic. Back in New England, where I used to live, it would not have been feasible.

On the Interstates, the speed limits are 60 - 70 mph. I'll run them at 10 mph over (indicated), which is only about 3 mph over (actual). There are more heavily patrolled.
 
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