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So before I bought my 2013 BMW C650GT, I searched the web for a comparison between the pre 2013 Burgman 650 and BMW C650GT. I couldn't find anything of relevance from someone who actually rode the Burgman and switched to the BMW. In fact, most of the reviews I read about the BMW, totally ignored or glanced over the Burgmans existence, making it sound like BMW really innovated and almost created a new segment.
I picked up my C650GT on Saturday morning in Tampa, FL and rode it home to Rockville, MD. I've also had three days to scoot around on it around town. These are my initial impressions (AKA, what I already miss about the Burgman). I debated about writing this because it's going to sound awful, like I hate the BMW. I really don't, I'm just used to certain things that the BUrgman spoiled me with and will have to get used to doing things a bit different.
First, a little background. I bought a 2004 Suzuki Burgman 650 in 2006. Although I've owned other bikes before and during this time, the Burgman was the one constant and my favorite because of the ease and convenience. In the time I owned the Burgman, I was in two minor accidents, each leaving the Burgman with some quirks. One, a front disc slide got tweaked so the front brake always rubbed mildy. Second, the fairings under the right side footboard didn't fit together flush and when wind would get in there at high speeds, the rubber mat would wobble (which was pretty alarming at first when you weren't expecting it). Third, the forks probably needed relaxing because between 70-75, the whole front end would weave. Finally, the check engine light would come on if you used power mode or really pushed it. The code was 'intermittent connection' and no local shop could figure it out. These quirks made my favorite bike only my daily driver. I decided I'd sell it and buy another one in better shape.
The 2013 Burgman had just come out but I wasn't looking to spend that much. I found a 2012 Burgman (which was an upgrade as all 2012's were "Executive" models) with 915 miles for $6,499. Then I saw the BMW C650GT for sale in the BurgmanUSA classifieds for $8,500. I did a little research, visited a dealer to see one in person, and decided I didn't want to buy the same bike I've been riding for 8 years, it was time for a change, something new.
The first thing I noticed about the BMW was the storage. I had seen this at the dealer that the BMW had only two dash compartments, no center glove box. Also, the under seat area looked smaller. This didn't hit home until I arrived at the airport (4.5 hours late because of a flight delay, very patient seller!), went to throw my backpack under the seat, and it didn't fit. I had to readjust things that would have easily fit in the Burgman. My L-XXL helmets don't fit either, well not without pushing the seat closed after it makes contact with the helmet.
The dash compartments were not as practical as the Burgman either. The right side one is small with different indentations and levels, it's not a square box with a single flat surface. The left one is larger, with an accessory outlet on the back wall. This one locks with the ignition and fits a soda bottle, but would you want a soda bottle with it's condensation in the pocket with the 12V outlet? (for the record, I had installed a 12V accessory outlet in the center glovebox of my Burgman but still had the two dash pockets for all my other items). Also, the hinges on the dash pocket (and seat) seem very cheap and flimsy and are almost guaranteed to break eventually. I'm also not sure why the dash pocket doors fold down so far and are so extensive, although this did seem to keep things in a bit better than the Burgman while accessing the pockets while riding, which I don't do often. But I could open the dash pocket door into my knee and reach in and grab what I needed. The design of these doors coming down so far has made finding a practical tunnel bag difficult (as mentioned on WebBikeWorld) as the tunnel bag would have to be very narrow in order to open the doors.
The under seat storage is lit by a light on the side of the compartment that comes on with the ignition and stays on a short time after the ignition is turned off. This is a nice feature so that you don't forget to turn the light off, but being on the side, instead of under the seat, makes it useless because as soon as you put something in there, basically in front of it, it blocks all the light.
On the top of the seat, the butt rest is not as adjustable as the Burgman. The manual says you can unscrew it, release some bumpers and reattach it, but this doesn't seem like it would be much of an adjustment and is a lot of work. I never needed to adjust my Burgman seat but was surprised that it wasn't there.
The BMW sits taller than the Burgman, which I was uncertain about, but I actually prefer. The distance between the seat bumper and front floorboards seems longer too, as I can stretch my legs straight without having to sit ON the butt rest like I did with the Burgman. The floorboards however, have a little flex to them when I do this, which I don't remember on my Burgman. The metal in the floorboards looks nice too, but I'm afraid over time this accent piece will start to look poor.
The paint on the center hump makes you have to be careful and conscious as to not scuff or scratch, and the hump is angled, not flat. On long road trips, I used to occasionally place my feet on the hump. Can't do that on the BMW. The center hump feels wider than the Burgman, and the footboards feel narrower, especially towards the rear.
The BMW does not have the ignition cover or the ignition position to turn on the rear brake light. No power mode for passing (or just fun!) and no parking brake. The brake does come on when the side stand is engaged, but this doesn't help at a stoplight on an incline unless you want to stop the engine to engage the brake and remove both hands from the handlebars. This also caught me off guard as I killed the engine and dropped the side stand while coasting into a parking spot. I use the side stand much more than on the Burgman because getting the BMW on the center stand is even more difficult than it was on the Burgman. I parked on a steep decline using the side stand and the scooter stayed in place very well. As I walked away, I imagined the day in the future that I rely on the brake engaged side stand, the brake isn't adjusted properly, and I watch the scooter slowly roll forward onto it's side.
The BMW seems to have better element protection than the Burgman did stock. A Clearview XXL and then a GIVI XL improved my Burgman, but the side fairings on the BMW seem to direct the wind/rain better as I barely got wet in the storms on the ride home. The downside to the BMW fairings is that they stick out further than the dash pockets, creating a surface that is good at snagging your shirt, backpack, or skin on your knee if you dismount the scooter too quickly without thinking about it. Depending on how fast and strong you are hooked, you could possibly pull the scooter over with you.
The adjustable windshield is very nice, although this is an option on the Burgman too (and standard depending on the year). I can't wait to install n aftermarket windshield on the BMW as the factory one is too short for my taste. The option currently is whether I want wind on my head, on my chest and head, or somewhere in between. I really want the option of no wind, or wind.
When behind the windshield, the BMW is very quiet. You don't hear much, it's just you and the bike. The BMW sounds more like a Burgman 400 to me than a 650. It has that Jetsons sound to it and whine that I hear more on the Burgman 400 than it's larger counterpart. Unfortunately, this is sort of the case with the power too. The BMW is slower than the Burgman 650 with a lower top speed. When I asked the seller how he compared the BMW to the Burgman, he said that he thought the BMW felt more sturdy. I find the exact opposite. The Burgman seemed more planted and the BMW seems more affected by wind. I often would be riding the Burgman and would look down to be surprised by a speed of 100+ mph (indicated). The BMW starts weaving and shaking right after 80 mph (indicated). In fact, I tried a few times on my 14 hour trip home to hit BMW's 109 mph max speed claim. The closest I got was on a road with not another car in site (it really wobbles with anything else around) when I hit 105 mph (indicated). I was not comfortable at all and wanted to get back to my 80-85 mph comfort zone quickly. I once got a ticket for doing 115 mph on the Burgman (122 mph indicated, 115 on the radar). I felt like I was doing 60.
The BMW has heated grips and seat, which I'm sure are nice but I haven't had to use yet (you can add these to the Burgman aftermarket, I think factory on the 2013). It also has random pull out panels beneath the windshield that I can only imagine are element protection. They're random because I don't notice a difference no matter what position they're in, and whatever holds them in place when you pull them out feels like it will wear out and they'll eventually only stay in the rear (or closed) postion. I haven't actually looked up what these are supposed to do so I may be way off.
The BMW mirrors are mounted high, unlike the Burgman. Mounting high on the stalks gives you a sport bike-like view of your arms. You need to bring your elbows in to see behind you. The mirrors also vibrate and shake more since the mounts aren't as sturdy. On mine specifically, the left one much more than the right. The Burgman of course gives you a clear, steady view from below your arms.
The BMW gas tank access is under a panel at the front of the seat, sort of like the Yamaha Zuma 125. The difference is that if you pop the panel open to access the cap (it's the opposite direction of opening the seat), and you open the seat while that panel is open... the panel breaks off. BMW says they are aware of the issue and it will be resolved in a future generation.
Once you squeeze the gas pump nozzle fully into the tank and wait for the auto shut off to stop pumping gas, you'll need to pull the nozzle out, rest it against the guard and top off the fuel until you see it puddle a little or your gas gauge may not read completely full. The gauges on the BMW are quite informative, giving you an analog gauge for the speedometer (going up to 120 mph which you'll never hit) and digital gauges for everything from fuel and tach, to average MPG, average speed, temperature and more. I'm not sure how accurate the temperature gauge is, as it always seems to read higher than actual temp. Today it read 120 degrees at one point.
When you hit reserve fuel, the odometer automatically becomes a counter indicating how many miles you've ridden on reserve. Using your average MPG and knowing that the reserve is about a gallon, and you've got a while to make the next gas station once this starts.
My Burgman had the bungee hooks which I used often with a bare bungee net. The BMW does not have these, or a place for them to screw in. Using a net with hooks will scratch the grab bars more than the style on the Burgman.
The headlight on the BMW is not as bright or reach as far as on the Burgman. I use the high beam as often as possible without blinding other drivers. Also, when going around turns, you can't see in front of you. The BMW light reflects in a very distinct triangle. Imagine a triangle with the tip at the headlight and the wide base on the street about 15 feet in front of you. When you turn, the corner of the triangle base comes in towards the direction you are turning, and the other corner goes outward. This is a solid flat line on the road though so you can't see beyond the point (almost pointed straight down in the corner closest to you) where the light hits the ground straight across. Hard to explain but very obvious. I had seen a video somewhere where BMW has a complicated electronic headlight system that's supposed to help in turns, I had never had the problem they showed in the video so it looked like an infomercial selling something solving a problem that didn't exist. If this is how their non adaptive headlight system works, I now see the need. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cB_9H7NtT0. The tail lights on the BMW fog on the inside also. The fog disappears in a circle where the bulbs heat up the plastic lens.
Although slower overall and weighing more than the Burgman, the BMW feels much more nimble and corners much better than the Suzuki. It's been a long time since I looked through a turn on a maxi scooter without being conscious of the lean angle of the bike as the Burgman center stand grabbing the road taught me not to do that. The BMW with its taller stance and stiffer suspension feel almost sport like and make me want to try more twisties than I've tried to find on my Burgman.
When I first bought my Burgman in 2006, it was still relatively new and peoples reactions to it were fun to see. When I first rode it I thought it should have BMW emblems on it because it felt very luxury and well refined. Now that I own an actual BMW scooter, I think Suzuki deserves the credit for making a solid machine that has stood the test of time with minimal changes. After all these 'gripes', I still love the BMW. It's exactly what I wanted, a large scooter that can compete with the Burgman but isn't essentially the same thing I've been riding for 8 years. I'm very happy with the price I paid and the reactions on peoples faces when they see it (especially the second looks it gets once they see the emblems and the stares from BMW automobile drivers on the road). My KIA Soul had this effect in 2009 when I first bought it, as did the Burgman in the early days at gas stations and parking lots, sparking conversations about things I enjoyed chatting about. It's fast enough for my daily commute and keeps me out of trouble on longer weekend trips.
I knew that Apple had it's fan boys but had never experienced the BMW ones. From the comments at gas stations to the guy that rolled his window down to tell me "nice bike" as I merged in front of him at a highway construction zone, it gets a lot of respect. It's comfortable too. I make the trip from the DC region to FL once a year and on the Burgman, as I approached my destination, I was ready to get off the bike. After the 14 hour ride this weekend, I walked in and asked my girlfriend if she wanted to hop on and continue my ride with a 2.5 hour trip to the beach. She told me that I was crazy and to come inside.
It's a little sad to me that Suzuki has had the maxi scooter mastered for years but some only pay attention and take it seriously because a 'luxury' brand creates one. BMW definitely didn't innovate or create anything new here. They need some refinement to really compete with the convenience and practicality of the Suzuki but at least they decided that it was a worthwhile segment to enter and brought another option. Other riders and friends, who have seen me on my Burgman plenty of times, have now seemed to notice what I'm riding. "BMW puts a lot of engineering into their products", "Wow. Nice bike, luxury...", "This looks a lot better than your last bike". It's funny what some plastic emblems will do. But I'll take it.
If I were considering a BMW for $12k or a 2013 Burgman 650 for 13k, I'd probably lean towards the Burgman. But not foreseeing anyone giving up their new Burgman for a while for close to $8k, I'm glad that someone decided to list a BMW in a Suzuki forum.
I picked up my C650GT on Saturday morning in Tampa, FL and rode it home to Rockville, MD. I've also had three days to scoot around on it around town. These are my initial impressions (AKA, what I already miss about the Burgman). I debated about writing this because it's going to sound awful, like I hate the BMW. I really don't, I'm just used to certain things that the BUrgman spoiled me with and will have to get used to doing things a bit different.
First, a little background. I bought a 2004 Suzuki Burgman 650 in 2006. Although I've owned other bikes before and during this time, the Burgman was the one constant and my favorite because of the ease and convenience. In the time I owned the Burgman, I was in two minor accidents, each leaving the Burgman with some quirks. One, a front disc slide got tweaked so the front brake always rubbed mildy. Second, the fairings under the right side footboard didn't fit together flush and when wind would get in there at high speeds, the rubber mat would wobble (which was pretty alarming at first when you weren't expecting it). Third, the forks probably needed relaxing because between 70-75, the whole front end would weave. Finally, the check engine light would come on if you used power mode or really pushed it. The code was 'intermittent connection' and no local shop could figure it out. These quirks made my favorite bike only my daily driver. I decided I'd sell it and buy another one in better shape.
The 2013 Burgman had just come out but I wasn't looking to spend that much. I found a 2012 Burgman (which was an upgrade as all 2012's were "Executive" models) with 915 miles for $6,499. Then I saw the BMW C650GT for sale in the BurgmanUSA classifieds for $8,500. I did a little research, visited a dealer to see one in person, and decided I didn't want to buy the same bike I've been riding for 8 years, it was time for a change, something new.
The first thing I noticed about the BMW was the storage. I had seen this at the dealer that the BMW had only two dash compartments, no center glove box. Also, the under seat area looked smaller. This didn't hit home until I arrived at the airport (4.5 hours late because of a flight delay, very patient seller!), went to throw my backpack under the seat, and it didn't fit. I had to readjust things that would have easily fit in the Burgman. My L-XXL helmets don't fit either, well not without pushing the seat closed after it makes contact with the helmet.
The dash compartments were not as practical as the Burgman either. The right side one is small with different indentations and levels, it's not a square box with a single flat surface. The left one is larger, with an accessory outlet on the back wall. This one locks with the ignition and fits a soda bottle, but would you want a soda bottle with it's condensation in the pocket with the 12V outlet? (for the record, I had installed a 12V accessory outlet in the center glovebox of my Burgman but still had the two dash pockets for all my other items). Also, the hinges on the dash pocket (and seat) seem very cheap and flimsy and are almost guaranteed to break eventually. I'm also not sure why the dash pocket doors fold down so far and are so extensive, although this did seem to keep things in a bit better than the Burgman while accessing the pockets while riding, which I don't do often. But I could open the dash pocket door into my knee and reach in and grab what I needed. The design of these doors coming down so far has made finding a practical tunnel bag difficult (as mentioned on WebBikeWorld) as the tunnel bag would have to be very narrow in order to open the doors.
The under seat storage is lit by a light on the side of the compartment that comes on with the ignition and stays on a short time after the ignition is turned off. This is a nice feature so that you don't forget to turn the light off, but being on the side, instead of under the seat, makes it useless because as soon as you put something in there, basically in front of it, it blocks all the light.
On the top of the seat, the butt rest is not as adjustable as the Burgman. The manual says you can unscrew it, release some bumpers and reattach it, but this doesn't seem like it would be much of an adjustment and is a lot of work. I never needed to adjust my Burgman seat but was surprised that it wasn't there.
The BMW sits taller than the Burgman, which I was uncertain about, but I actually prefer. The distance between the seat bumper and front floorboards seems longer too, as I can stretch my legs straight without having to sit ON the butt rest like I did with the Burgman. The floorboards however, have a little flex to them when I do this, which I don't remember on my Burgman. The metal in the floorboards looks nice too, but I'm afraid over time this accent piece will start to look poor.
The paint on the center hump makes you have to be careful and conscious as to not scuff or scratch, and the hump is angled, not flat. On long road trips, I used to occasionally place my feet on the hump. Can't do that on the BMW. The center hump feels wider than the Burgman, and the footboards feel narrower, especially towards the rear.
The BMW does not have the ignition cover or the ignition position to turn on the rear brake light. No power mode for passing (or just fun!) and no parking brake. The brake does come on when the side stand is engaged, but this doesn't help at a stoplight on an incline unless you want to stop the engine to engage the brake and remove both hands from the handlebars. This also caught me off guard as I killed the engine and dropped the side stand while coasting into a parking spot. I use the side stand much more than on the Burgman because getting the BMW on the center stand is even more difficult than it was on the Burgman. I parked on a steep decline using the side stand and the scooter stayed in place very well. As I walked away, I imagined the day in the future that I rely on the brake engaged side stand, the brake isn't adjusted properly, and I watch the scooter slowly roll forward onto it's side.
The BMW seems to have better element protection than the Burgman did stock. A Clearview XXL and then a GIVI XL improved my Burgman, but the side fairings on the BMW seem to direct the wind/rain better as I barely got wet in the storms on the ride home. The downside to the BMW fairings is that they stick out further than the dash pockets, creating a surface that is good at snagging your shirt, backpack, or skin on your knee if you dismount the scooter too quickly without thinking about it. Depending on how fast and strong you are hooked, you could possibly pull the scooter over with you.
The adjustable windshield is very nice, although this is an option on the Burgman too (and standard depending on the year). I can't wait to install n aftermarket windshield on the BMW as the factory one is too short for my taste. The option currently is whether I want wind on my head, on my chest and head, or somewhere in between. I really want the option of no wind, or wind.
When behind the windshield, the BMW is very quiet. You don't hear much, it's just you and the bike. The BMW sounds more like a Burgman 400 to me than a 650. It has that Jetsons sound to it and whine that I hear more on the Burgman 400 than it's larger counterpart. Unfortunately, this is sort of the case with the power too. The BMW is slower than the Burgman 650 with a lower top speed. When I asked the seller how he compared the BMW to the Burgman, he said that he thought the BMW felt more sturdy. I find the exact opposite. The Burgman seemed more planted and the BMW seems more affected by wind. I often would be riding the Burgman and would look down to be surprised by a speed of 100+ mph (indicated). The BMW starts weaving and shaking right after 80 mph (indicated). In fact, I tried a few times on my 14 hour trip home to hit BMW's 109 mph max speed claim. The closest I got was on a road with not another car in site (it really wobbles with anything else around) when I hit 105 mph (indicated). I was not comfortable at all and wanted to get back to my 80-85 mph comfort zone quickly. I once got a ticket for doing 115 mph on the Burgman (122 mph indicated, 115 on the radar). I felt like I was doing 60.
The BMW has heated grips and seat, which I'm sure are nice but I haven't had to use yet (you can add these to the Burgman aftermarket, I think factory on the 2013). It also has random pull out panels beneath the windshield that I can only imagine are element protection. They're random because I don't notice a difference no matter what position they're in, and whatever holds them in place when you pull them out feels like it will wear out and they'll eventually only stay in the rear (or closed) postion. I haven't actually looked up what these are supposed to do so I may be way off.
The BMW mirrors are mounted high, unlike the Burgman. Mounting high on the stalks gives you a sport bike-like view of your arms. You need to bring your elbows in to see behind you. The mirrors also vibrate and shake more since the mounts aren't as sturdy. On mine specifically, the left one much more than the right. The Burgman of course gives you a clear, steady view from below your arms.
The BMW gas tank access is under a panel at the front of the seat, sort of like the Yamaha Zuma 125. The difference is that if you pop the panel open to access the cap (it's the opposite direction of opening the seat), and you open the seat while that panel is open... the panel breaks off. BMW says they are aware of the issue and it will be resolved in a future generation.
Once you squeeze the gas pump nozzle fully into the tank and wait for the auto shut off to stop pumping gas, you'll need to pull the nozzle out, rest it against the guard and top off the fuel until you see it puddle a little or your gas gauge may not read completely full. The gauges on the BMW are quite informative, giving you an analog gauge for the speedometer (going up to 120 mph which you'll never hit) and digital gauges for everything from fuel and tach, to average MPG, average speed, temperature and more. I'm not sure how accurate the temperature gauge is, as it always seems to read higher than actual temp. Today it read 120 degrees at one point.
When you hit reserve fuel, the odometer automatically becomes a counter indicating how many miles you've ridden on reserve. Using your average MPG and knowing that the reserve is about a gallon, and you've got a while to make the next gas station once this starts.
My Burgman had the bungee hooks which I used often with a bare bungee net. The BMW does not have these, or a place for them to screw in. Using a net with hooks will scratch the grab bars more than the style on the Burgman.
The headlight on the BMW is not as bright or reach as far as on the Burgman. I use the high beam as often as possible without blinding other drivers. Also, when going around turns, you can't see in front of you. The BMW light reflects in a very distinct triangle. Imagine a triangle with the tip at the headlight and the wide base on the street about 15 feet in front of you. When you turn, the corner of the triangle base comes in towards the direction you are turning, and the other corner goes outward. This is a solid flat line on the road though so you can't see beyond the point (almost pointed straight down in the corner closest to you) where the light hits the ground straight across. Hard to explain but very obvious. I had seen a video somewhere where BMW has a complicated electronic headlight system that's supposed to help in turns, I had never had the problem they showed in the video so it looked like an infomercial selling something solving a problem that didn't exist. If this is how their non adaptive headlight system works, I now see the need. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cB_9H7NtT0. The tail lights on the BMW fog on the inside also. The fog disappears in a circle where the bulbs heat up the plastic lens.
Although slower overall and weighing more than the Burgman, the BMW feels much more nimble and corners much better than the Suzuki. It's been a long time since I looked through a turn on a maxi scooter without being conscious of the lean angle of the bike as the Burgman center stand grabbing the road taught me not to do that. The BMW with its taller stance and stiffer suspension feel almost sport like and make me want to try more twisties than I've tried to find on my Burgman.
When I first bought my Burgman in 2006, it was still relatively new and peoples reactions to it were fun to see. When I first rode it I thought it should have BMW emblems on it because it felt very luxury and well refined. Now that I own an actual BMW scooter, I think Suzuki deserves the credit for making a solid machine that has stood the test of time with minimal changes. After all these 'gripes', I still love the BMW. It's exactly what I wanted, a large scooter that can compete with the Burgman but isn't essentially the same thing I've been riding for 8 years. I'm very happy with the price I paid and the reactions on peoples faces when they see it (especially the second looks it gets once they see the emblems and the stares from BMW automobile drivers on the road). My KIA Soul had this effect in 2009 when I first bought it, as did the Burgman in the early days at gas stations and parking lots, sparking conversations about things I enjoyed chatting about. It's fast enough for my daily commute and keeps me out of trouble on longer weekend trips.
I knew that Apple had it's fan boys but had never experienced the BMW ones. From the comments at gas stations to the guy that rolled his window down to tell me "nice bike" as I merged in front of him at a highway construction zone, it gets a lot of respect. It's comfortable too. I make the trip from the DC region to FL once a year and on the Burgman, as I approached my destination, I was ready to get off the bike. After the 14 hour ride this weekend, I walked in and asked my girlfriend if she wanted to hop on and continue my ride with a 2.5 hour trip to the beach. She told me that I was crazy and to come inside.
It's a little sad to me that Suzuki has had the maxi scooter mastered for years but some only pay attention and take it seriously because a 'luxury' brand creates one. BMW definitely didn't innovate or create anything new here. They need some refinement to really compete with the convenience and practicality of the Suzuki but at least they decided that it was a worthwhile segment to enter and brought another option. Other riders and friends, who have seen me on my Burgman plenty of times, have now seemed to notice what I'm riding. "BMW puts a lot of engineering into their products", "Wow. Nice bike, luxury...", "This looks a lot better than your last bike". It's funny what some plastic emblems will do. But I'll take it.
If I were considering a BMW for $12k or a 2013 Burgman 650 for 13k, I'd probably lean towards the Burgman. But not foreseeing anyone giving up their new Burgman for a while for close to $8k, I'm glad that someone decided to list a BMW in a Suzuki forum.
ccasion5::wave:
