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Discussion Starter #1
Is the final gear oil and the transmission oil the same thing on the 400?

In the service manual in the contents for Periodic Maintenance (page 2-1)
it shows Transmisson oil (page 2-11) but in the Periodic Maintenance chart it shows ("final gear oil") but I don't find Transmission Oil anywhere in the chart and on page 2-11 there is no mention of "final gear oil" just "transmission oil.
 

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There was a correction sticker sent to me for the '04 400 owners manual by Suzuki. The "final drive" (no transmission oil on 400) is the same type of oil as the engine, 10w40, if I remember correctly. There was a big discussion on the manual error when it was discovered last year. I am sure some other 400 owners will remember it and will have their owners' manuals. Suzuki terminology is inconsistant.
 

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Yes use the same oil...................
As it happens I don't, I do use engine oil but a 20W50 in the final drive.
For the engine I use 10W40
Keep in mind this part of the country get hot. :(
 

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Heavier oil actually runs hotter than lighter oil at a given temperature.
 

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When you read the oil chart in any given manual, a thicker oil is recommended for hotter ambient temperatures. Is there some other factor you are considering? I tend to agree with Randy on this one ... I run 20w50 in the summer because the oil tends to thin out when it gets really hot, and 10w40 in the winter for better lubrication when starting.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Re: Roy is right

Bendi said:
So says the service manual as well. Use the same oil for both.
I know that the engine and final gear oil uses the same oil. My owners manual has that info corrected in it. My question is that the service manual k3 k4 on page 2-11 shows

Transmission Oil
replace every 1200 km (7 500 miles, 12 mounths) thereafter

Taransmission (yes it' spelled that way) Oil Replacement
Keep the motorcycle upright with the centerstand
Remove the left side leg shield (7-15)
Remove the clutch cover (3-16)
Place an oil pan below the mission case

and so on.

Now the service manual does not say final gear oil there it says Transmission Oil
So my question is. Is the Transmission Oil thier talking about on page 2-11 really the Final Gear Oil and is this yet another error they have printed in this book? [/b]

Thanks Steve
 

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Call it what ever you like...

There are two places for oil only !
Engine and Final Gear or call it Transmission.
Both use the same type (on the AN400).
Replace engine oil at :1000, 6000 12000......
Replace Final Gear oil at : 12000, 24000,36000 .............
So says the official Suzuki Service Manual.
 

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All else being the same, higher viscosity oils require greater energy to move at the same rate through the system, compared to lower viscosity oil. Much of the additional energy is imparted to the oil in the form of heat. On a hot day and under heavy load, heavier oils will run hotter than lighter ones. I noticed this in practice years ago on one of my bikes that had an oil temperature gauge and an oil cooler. This is probably less of a problem on newer liquid cooled bike engines than older aircooled ones that relied more heavily on oil for cooling.
It us usually best to adhere to manufacturers recommendations regarding lubricant characteristics. You may also notice that some automobile engines use very low viscosity oils, eg., 0W-20, etc., even in higher ambient operating temperatures.
Lastly, higher than recommended viscosity will decrease overall powertrain efficiency and increase fuel consumption and performance.
 

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Whoops! What I meant to say was......"increase fuel consumption and degrade performance."
 

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If you have a fear of the oil thinning out, then by all means step up to a synthetic of the same weight. What I WOULD NOT do is go to a thicker oil.
 

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docta,

What you say makes sense except you are leaving out the fact that although thicker oils may rob a tiny bit of performance and efficiency, they also protect the engine better within reasonable measures. Heat in an engine is not a problem unless it is too hot, but thin oil in a hot motor on a hot day will break down sooner and stop protecting as much. It is obviously a trade-off and I have used both thin and thick oils on the same machines with a change in performance and mileage of less than 1%. But I do notice with the 20w50 in Texas summer heat, the motor runs smoother with less internal noise than with 10w40. In particular, thumpers and v-twins seem to benefit from the thicker oil and don't have much performance degredation ... mostly because they don't rev as high for the usable power and therefore do not need the higher rate of flow through.

But for what it is worth, I have no knowledge of someone losing a motor due to a wrong choice between common motor oils that are kept fresh.
 

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Hi Everyone ,
I pick up my new Burgman 400 in a few weeks and I have a Question regarding oil .
Does the Burgman 400 take normal automative oil in the engine or does it take motorcycle grade oil ?
What grade of oil ( ie 10W40 ) do we normally put in the Burgman here in Ontario , Canada ?
Can't wait to get my new Burgy . I am just getting the Money and Insurance sorted out now
 

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FYI ... the Majesty takes normal 10w30 motor oil in the transmission. Yamaha recommends Yamalube, of course, but regular automotive oil will work just fine. I would imagine the same is true for the Burgman 400.
 

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From an Earlier post, This should help some. There is a big debate on oil, but you should at least, meet the minimums listed in the manual.

Gino said:
Choosing the Right Motor Oil

What to Look for on a Motor Oil Label
The symbol at left is referred to as the "API donut." It gives you three pieces of information. API (American Petroleum Institute) Service Rating: This two-letter classification identifies the vehicle fuel type and quality level of the motor oil. The first letter indicates the vehicle fuel type that the oil is designed for. Ratings that begin with an "S" are intended for gasoline engines. Ratings that begin with a "C" are for diesel engine. The second letter designates the quality level of the motor oil. The higher the letter, the more advanced the oil and the more protection it offers your engine. An SJ oil can be used in any engine requiring an SB, SG, SH, etc. oil

This might help clarify the API rating for motor oil.
Since Mobil 1 is rated SL it should meet and exceed the requirements of SF/SG called for in the Burgman 650 owners manual. Yes??? No???
I found this info at this site.
http://www.chevron.com/prodserv/nafl/au ... htm#choose
 

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For what it's worth................
My main reason for going to a 20 W 50 in the finial drive is not about heat, I feel a somewhat thicker oil will offer better cushioning between parts, and since the final drive does not depend on "splashing" oil to lub. and cool like the engine I feel it works better and I believe (like texascycle) I can hear a difference.
Both engine & final drive use synthetic oil
 

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SwisTiles - Ya know.... - I dunno.

I've always believed the old school heavy oil vs light oil mantra. Heavy - hot, light - cold. It always seemed to make sense to me. I didn't know of the "scientific" way of dispersing that opine thru my grey matter.

My opinion is to run mfg spec lube whilst under warrenty. Then - heck - run what cha brung! The S ratings should belly up though (cept ina 'mergency!)

OLDER vehicles though (like over 50 thousand miles)?? - well, IMHO, it's up to the owner to decide. Straight weight (which I believe helps oil consumption issues in older sleds...) 20-50? ("thicker" hence better suited for heat - supposedly) Or stick with the (seemingly light) 10 - 30 "norm" that seems to be quite ubiquidous nowadaize.... :roll:

Hey - if something's clackin, clickin, or smokin...(on an older conveyance) I am in the hunt for a different lube.

Which reminds me of two things....somebody post a poll!??!! What is the highest mile Burger out there, and, well...pause...

Synthetic oil. My very best friend that I bought a BWM 320i from had used synthetic in it from its 70k mile marker. I sold it after the ODO had spun over trice. Is it worth the extra bux!? I kept feeding it the same diet of oil and it made it past 300 thousand miles before I sold it to a jet jock outta NAS p-cola (running and looking good too! - cept the drivers seat was sort of crushed! :oops: )

I don't like switching brand names because they come out of (usually) different holes in the ground. I don't mind switching wieght if it seems to help make the motor run cooler, smoother, or quieter, but when it comes to synthetics....well, they just seem darn expensive.

Just more .02c-worth.
pedz
 

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Well at the Business (Towing Service, Heavy Machinery Transport, Salvage Yard) we always use Shell Rotella 15W-40...and we get it by the Barrel.

Mutlitpurpose Gasoline/Diesel Oil used in everything from the Lawnmower to the Front End Loader.

Warranty Specs are ignored (though Rotella Meets Them) and everything gets oil changed at 3-5000 miles depending on service serverity.

Most Gas engines make 150,000 miles (odometer reading...Double that for Idling Time) before Pooping...Diesels usually make 250,000 plus another 250,000 worth of Idle time before they need rebuilding.

Caterpillar Loader made 6 plus hours a day for 10 Years before finally Spinning a Bearing.

Another MAJOR Caveat....Use ONLY Arabian Crude Oil...which Rotella is...

Pennsylvania Crudes...and ya'll know the brands...Glop up as they break down and over time will leave greater and greater deposits of a Waxy Heavy Sludge in the Motor...until the Oil Drain Ports in the block get clogged and the motor blows up.

And if you do just a tiny bit of research you will find the Biggest Purveyors of Chemicals designed to remove this Sludge are the same Pennsylvania Oil Producers.

Engines using Pennsylvania Crudes have a MUCH higher failure rate as they near 100,000 miles than those using Arabian Crude.

I've got 33 years experience seeing this happen...I can pull a Valve Cover and almost always Correctly Guess the Brand of Oil the person is using by the level of buildup on and around the Valve Springs.

~ Roland
 

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Extremely interesting post. Do you have any experience with synthetic. I use Mobil one in the cars and Shell Rotella Synthetic 5W40 in my Burgman. Since you obviously have more experience with oil than I do, I am hoping you can make som observations related to synthetic.

Thanks. Again, very interesting post!!
 

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Can't comment on the Synthetics...other than they are WAY too expensive...especially to use in a Diesel...Diesels have enough blowby in the sleeves that the oil gets dirty VERY quickly...on large trucks the normal oil change interval is 10,000 miles...in trucks like Ford F350, F450 and F550's 3-5000 miles is best.

One thing I DO know about them is if you have been using Synthetics you are Trapped...if you change to Natural Oil you won't get too many thousand more miles before the motor blows up.

Same goes for Oil Additives or Oil with/without Detergents...NEVER on an Older Motor change to Detergent Oil if all you've used is Non-Detergent...it washes all the coating thats built up in the cylinders out and the motor will start to smoke and usually not last long after that.

The Motors become Addicted to the additives and require them for proper operation.

We use Rotella 15-40 as it it is Heavy enough for the big diesels and Light enough for gas engines.
 
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