[thundercat]

I think most “common folk“ can see that as soon as they start looking at it

Most common folk...?
fancy reports

I 'think' people understand the concept of 'no free lunch'. The OP, wanted to know EV / ICE using synths... There is no free lunch, you pay now or later or both... 😒 Both make sense in different use cases for now.. Neither can do everything well. Some problems require both...
Everything takes energy... You have to manage that well...

Thomas Sowell put it another way... No matter what your solution is, there will be tradeoffs... You have to know what they are to determine if you and or society are willing to accept the tradeoffs. Germany during WW2 were willing to accept the tradeoffs with using synthetics and emissions it produced due to the war (necessity).

The 'common folk' will make the right decision if they are told the pros and cons. It's only when you don't or hide something where you run into problems, a popular tactic is omission, starting with some of the truth etc... Another tactic they use is creating a 'false necessity' to push a solution to hide 'cons' or make people think the cons are worth it. The 'nutters' have been screaming the sky is falling for decades. "The world will end in 2000 cuz this etc,". There all on video, print.. This is in anything, tech / health / finance.. You don't need to be a super 'authority' to make decisions... the vid shows that with the 'ford engineer'... Open discussion will mitigate this but the people who stand to profit know this also and will try to shutdown open discussion...

I'd stick with EVs for my slot cars in the living room, indoor environment so I can race in feezing / rain / heat wave indoors. Obviously if some idiot mandates no EVs, this wouldn't work, unless your the kinda guy who thinks islands may tip over if your have too many people racing on one of the island. Some people use giant scale trains outdoors with ICE or actual steam... In my 'opinion', I'd advoid EVs as a sole mode of transportation, stick with ICEs if you can only afford 1 vehicle. Most EV owners probably can afford more than 1 vehicle. Good to have both but many can't afford it. Remember, a ICE car is basically a generator on wheels as much as a EV is a battery on wheels.
If you have 4 seasons, I'd stick with a ICE for the cold season and use the EV during warmer seasons. Even in the USA you can get stuck in urban areas in cold weather for many hours, a half tank of synth or plain gas will last a lot longer to keep you warm then a semi full battery in cold conditions. If you're in a flood zone, EVs can turn into a torch if the battery is compromised that's difficult for most fire dept's to put out. etc... I'm not trying to hide anything but there are probably other tradeoffs associated with a 1000 pound battery and ICEs but you're probably familiar with most ICE tradeoffs.

My favorite engineer, Scotty sez, "how many times did I hav to tell you, use the right tool for the job"...

 

[Charbroil]

They are categorised by emissions level. Renewables are similar (non) emitters

That is incorrect. Landfill gas capture, and direct trash burning are classified as renewable. They are emitters.

 

[Bluebottle]

Fine.

Landfill emissions come from the landfill with or without collection and burning process to less problematic gases -so it emits less than it takes in. It is therefore negative and classed as renewable.

This is readily vailable info, but fine - I’m out of energy and nobody wants to know.

 

[thundercat]

I only saw the young engineer speak her opinion for 4 seconds starting at 2:41. Did she interview more? You know what they say about opinions. Is she a high ranking EV engineering group manager, or just one of hundreds of engineers? Maybe she’s a materials engineer, or an electrical engineer with 1 year of experience? I didn’t see her qualifications, and/or the reason SHE was the chosen Ford voice for the video.

I'm sure she is a cool smart kid. That vid clip was part of a longer interview and it could be out of context, doubtful but possible. Even if she did believe what she said if she did examine the VW study she would be wise enough to see the 'full' picture or pause to consider at least. Life and experience and her Eng instructors should have drilled into her head that 0 emissions is like claiming the free energy scams you see everywhere, perpetual motion machines etc... I'm not trying to smear that lady but to point out people like her, 'authorities', can be blind to what is obvious to everyone else. Her name, sex is not relevant. For an interesting read, look at history of M16 rifle. Names are included there.

I would like to know if someone is a scammer or who maybe 'omitting' something...
Bluebottle stated this earlier:
"I think you should check he so-called facts and figures in that vid for yourself...and who the physics expert is and who he works for (previously defended tobacco industry)"
If anyone has info on this regarding "Physics Professor Mark Mills", please share

Electric motors are a GREAT invention... If I had a choice to choose 1 or the other and the situation allowed for either, I'd pick the electric motor easy peasy.. You'd be a fool not too.. IMHOP.. Reality will not allow for that though.. Most EV motors in use today are tied to chemical combustion somewhere. Same as hydraulics... fuel tanks, batteries, accumulators.

Do not let doom sayers affect your decision.. They maybe able to force you down 1 path but reality will quickly force them to backtrack and ask for amnesty 😒 The fools who forced people down 1 path in the past may go unpunished and may get rich out of it but they only do so as long as you 'stay ignorant' see vid to see what I mean, not the perjorative, and allow them too.

Then sun is like the dog looking at the fleas arguing about ownership of the dog... The sun and the dog both don't care and will bite or fart (sun) you out of existence no matter how much CO2 you save.

BTW, there is decades of results, data, for that too.. Data and Tools Funny guy link..

 

[JRoss]

My favorite engineer, Scotty sez, "how many times did I hav to tell you, use the right tool for the job"...

...and

can't find it but thought he once said, 'first you must understand how a starship works'

 

[thundercat]

How many times do I have to tell you? The right tool for the right job!

Star Trek V: The Final Frontier (1989) clip with quote How many times do I have to tell you? The right tool for the right job! Yarn is the best search for video clips by quote. Find the exact moment in a TV show, movie, or music video you want to share. Easily move forward or...

getyarn.io

can't find it but thought he once said, 'first you must understand how a starship works'

Found this, not Scotty tho

 

[Bluebottle]

I only saw the young engineer speak her opinion for 4 seconds starting at 2:41. Did she interview more? You know what they say about opinions. Is she a high ranking EV engineering group manager, or just one of hundreds of engineers? Maybe she’s a materials engineer, or an electrical engineer with 1 year of experience? I didn’t see her qualifications, and/or the reason SHE was the chosen Ford voice for the video.

That is Linda Zhang, chief engineer on F-150 program.

(Also Escape, Kuga and Explorer, been with Ford over 25 yrs)

 

[Bluebottle]

If anyone has info on this regarding "Physics Professor Mark Mills", please share

No Professor Mark Mills anywhere?

Maybe try this without the professor part.

Mark P Mills
random oil company (Exxon Mobil)
random amount of money (1.3 million)

Or Peabody coal, or works for political pressure group

edit: typo in name

 

[Bigmc]

Going back to my OP..This sounds quite promising for us two wheel petrol heads , sounds very much like the Japanese bike manufacturers are planning synthetic fuel for future bikes ?
See HERE

 

[Charbroil]

Going back to my OP..This sounds quite promising for us two wheel petrol heads , sounds very much like the Japanese bike manufacturers are planning synthetic fuel for future bikes ?
See HERE

Yeh, Hydrogen in an ICE instead of gasoline or diesel, problem is, the production of hydrogen is still currently 95 percent from fossil fuels. I have a hard time getting excited about hydrogen.

 

[thundercat]

No Professor Mark Mills anywhere?

Maybe try this without the professor part.

Mark B Mills
random oil company (Exxon Mobil)
random amount of money (1.3 million)

Or Peabody coal, or works for political pressure group

I tried using Mark B Mills as you supplied. Nothing came up combined with peabody or tobacco. Used quotes around the name etc. If you have links can you do me a solid and put the link up.
I don't think you would be interested with what came up in my search.
Thanks.

 

[thundercat]

Going back to my OP..This sounds quite promising for us two wheel petrol heads , sounds very much like the Japanese bike manufacturers are planning synthetic fuel for future bikes ?
See HERE

As a tech, I'm interested but keep in mind, synth to like any other energy will require energy.. Batteries, H2, Oil, etc...

What uses the least amount of energy to create and deploy is the big question. Where it's sourced or synthesized will also factor in.
Right now, if your concerned with emissions, oil/gas/coal, generated/refined here in USA generates the least amount of emissions. Nuclear tops them all, even 'green' ship. If you look at the 'data' I linked to previously, emissions isn't a big concern but it it works for you.

If you watch the vid, you will see that synth probably won't make a big diff, brief summary, vehicles don't generate the most CO2, manufacturing and energy production does. It's a short vid, you should check it out if you get a chance. If CO2 matters to you that is.

Of course the pro in the vid could be the cigarette man from the xfiles.. Don't know yet. 😉
Short article from cig man.. cig man, energy

 

[Bluebottle]

Sorry, Typo - Mark P Mills
Its hard to find a link about Mr Mills that doesn’t break rules by mentioning his political activity and naming the political figures he is linked to.
These should be OK.

A Perfect Storm of Misinformation
ExxonMobil Is Still Bankrolling Climate Science Deniers

His Manhattan Foundation for Policy Research campaigned for tobacco industry, not him

 

[Bluebottle]

Going back to my OP..This sounds quite promising for us two wheel petrol heads , sounds very much like the Japanese bike manufacturers are planning synthetic fuel for future bikes ?

Yamaha already proposed purpose-built synthetic fuel bikes - but haven’t officially announced, I think they are going ahead with them in India first.

So there is some interest, at least as a bridge technology, same reason as aviation is interested - weight and real estate limitations.

 

[Bigmc]

Yeh, Hydrogen in an ICE instead of gasoline or diesel, problem is, the production of hydrogen is still currently 95 percent from fossil fuels. I have a hard time getting excited about hydrogen.

No there is a part on there Yamaha in particular about hydrogen but if you read to the end it says Quote :

“Japan’s major motorcycle manufacturers are already working on alternative fuels that allow internal combustion engines to produce zero CO2 emissions at the tail pipe, so if FEMA is correct and these types of motorcycles are approved for sale after 2035, there will be models ready for production, and throttle twisters will still be able to enjoy their vroom vroom.”

 

[thundercat]

Sorry, Typo - Mark P Mills
Its hard to find a link about Mr Mills that doesn’t break rules by mentioning his political activity and naming the political figures he is linked to.
These should be OK.

A Perfect Storm of Misinformation
ExxonMobil Is Still Bankrolling Climate Science Deniers

His Manhattan Foundation for Policy Research campaigned for tobacco industry, not him

Wow, thought this was going to be the cigarette man...
Bluebottle,
Your original statement regarding this person is false, borderline 'libel'. I don't believe you're joking on this. I doubt you will face any repercussions but you shouldn't use this tactic to disprove or prove your statements or his. This is formally called an logical ad hominem fallacy. Most 'common peeps' would call it being a d***... This institute you don't seem to hold in high regard has some very notable figures in tech and eco... Even if what you say is true, you can't blame the Mr. Mills for the actions of the org w/o some proof he was directly involved.

I read your first linked article and he does a better job at criticizing Mr. Mills. His refutation of Mr. Mills points are not sourced though. It seems to be his opinion which is fine. The 2nd link was behind a substack paywall. I tried to read a bit around to block asking for you to sub to him but I couldn't get enuff to fairly eval his critique.

I looked back at some of your previous posts regarding this topic, regarding CO2.. You have to understand, or at least acknowledge that at best, your info regarding CO2 is correlative but DOESN'T prove causation. This is another logical fallacy, a very important one.

There is a lot of other things now that I see seems the extent of info you have... The fact that I have to concern myself with politics creeping into this basic science is an illustration of how these 'scientists' seem to defend their poor, shoddy work that would flunk them from my high school chemistry class.

I think that the best I can do to help you is pointing out the data is available to the public. In my previous posts, I have added the links for ALL the weather stations NOAA operates and maintained for the past 100 years. You can use the web tools or download the datasets and use it as you will. These datasets include stations in the UK if your in the UK. Please share with others. Show it to your kids or others, ones blocking traffic and gluing themselves to stuff.. Show them it's ok. Spreading false fears and panic, especially to children, doesn't help the people who do research on these technologies, it hinders them. History shows this over and over.
I'll do one more solid for you and anyone else who's interested..
Economic Facts and Fallacies, Thomas Sowell. No politics in it. If I ever meet you in person I'll gift you the book. Not sure if your a russian / chinese bot yet. Did you know ruskies funded Greta's 'group'. Not saying she doesn't believe in it but it's worth noting..

1 last thing, thanks to you I have now discovered that I'm the same as Mr. Mills, a BSc with 'honors'... Dang it.. I thought I was just a janitor on the death star for the last 25 years... I was in such a hurry to get the hell out of there, I never bothered to look at the paper I got. I may join the manhattan institute, if Mr. Mills got in with just that, I can probably too.. Wonder if you would accuse me of the same, defender of tobacco and oil.

 

[Bluebottle]

Bluebottle,
Your original statement regarding this person is false, borderline 'libel'. I don't believe you're joking on this...you can't blame the Mr. Mills for the actions of the org w/o some proof he was directly involved.

I didn’t, I said “who he works for (previously defended tobacco industry)” they are named in the video.

He isn’t a professor, he has a bachelors degree in an unrelated subject, his video statements are incorrect and has gross omission. The stuff “the experts don’t know” - they do know, it’s basic background.

The fact that I have to concern myself with politics creeping into this basic science is an illustration of how these 'scientists' seem to defend their poor, shoddy work that would flunk them from my high school chemistry class.

No. The political stuff is because that is refuting a polical organisation, not science.

The science is an entirely different thing. We can trace man made CO2 from the tail pipe and directly observe radiative forcing in the atmosphere. It’s proven

If you want to start your own thread on that video I’ll happily go through some of it. This is somebody else’s thread.

 

[Bluebottle]

@Bigmc
on topic: you might be interested that a little while ago I was sent somw stuff that included a patent filed by Yamaha on a CO2 capture and separator for oxides of carbon.

I’ve been trying to find an English language version but had no luck (the original is in Japanese). There are some specialist companies too with filed patents.

There is technology around Rankine cycle and TSA (Temperature Swing Absorption) but again weight and real estate are troublesome.
Carbon Dioxide Capture From Internal Combustion Engine Exhaust Using Temperature Swing Adsorption

 

[thundercat]

I didn’t, I said “who he works for (previously defended tobacco industry)” they are named in the video.

He isn’t a professor, he has a bachelors degree in an unrelated subject, his video statements are incorrect and has gross omission. The stuff “the experts don’t know” - they do know, it’s basic background.

Ok, lets say you didn't mean to associate him as defending the tobacco and oil industry. You are trying to associate the institute with 'bad' industries. That's still 'ad hominem', you're not debating what they are saying, you are pointing trying to associate him or his org with whatever seems bad to you.
"he's not in the field"
This points back at the authority fallacy and ad hominem.. Your not in the field and I'm not in the field, I guess we can say 'in the field' meaning not making money doing that. If that is the case, he's making money doing that. In eng we use a lot of physics and we make fun of physics. You can't fit someone in a singularity, that's all these guys work with but pretty much everything in sciences is an off branch of physics. This isn't a good defense, all the marketing you see isn't physics. It's simple charting. Barely any more advanced then connect the dots I did when I was a kid.

YOU have access to the data, You can be more of an expert than any journalist. 'journalists' don't know anything and will market anything that makes them money. There are dishonest people, 'authorites', that will take advantage of their ignorance in basics or just even history. Really short vid that illustrates this with 'actual data' and print news clips.
fake stuff You can corroborate with noa data and print articles themselves.

No. The political stuff is because that is refuting a polical organisation, not science.

When gov't money involved, political. However, the institute to my knowledge hasn't backed any political campaigns from the org, their donors may have but not the institute.

The science is an entirely different thing. We can trace man made CO2 from the tail pipe and directly observe radiative forcing in the atmosphere. It’s proven

Their are only a 'few' production cases where causality has been proven, RTC's are very difficult in real world settings at a global scale. The person who said this was proven is wrong. I thought you had a link their but if you look at the fake stuff link it already disproves with the noa data available. Anyone who says they are the science is full of BS. Science is never settled. History has shown this.

If you want to start your own thread on that video I’ll happily go through some of it. This is somebody else’s thread.

I apologize to OP, please move these posts as you see fit. You have everything pointed out to you. Last link regarding psychology, Yuri Bezmenov

 

[Bluebottle]

Post: Some brief CO2 science