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Discussion Starter #1
So a week ago Saturday I changed engine oil & filter. I started it up to make sure I had no oil leaks. Also took front tire off & had a new one installed. Weather wasn't the best so I didn't ride once I put it all back together. Last Monday as my son & I rolled are bikes out to head to work mine wouldn't fire up. More I cranked the battery got low. As I bought it used I figured it's four years old, time for a new battery. New battery came Saturday & when my son & I pulled the old one it wasn't a OEM it had been changed. Any way we installed the new battery & still just cranked but no start. :confused:
I checked all the fuses were okay, cranks but no start & no F1 light. banghead:

After checking this site to see if anyone else had this king of problem I went back out & tried again. Each time I cranked it it seem to try & start. I cranked for maybe 15 second & it came to life. Ran it for a little shut it off & fired right up like always.

So any ideas why. :scratch:
 

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was the bike parked before the oil change? I'd have pushed the bike a few meters and try again.
 

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It is a common issue with these. Next time try cranking the throttle about 3/4's and hit the starter button.
 

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Others have had this issue come up including myself. Every once in a while the bike just doesn't want to start. First time it happened to me I had only had my 07 a couple of days. I loaded it on the trailer and took it back to the dealer. He said they would check it out but first he said he would try something. He held the brake and opened the throttle wide open then cranked it. It cranked for a couple of seconds then started coughing and trying to start. A little more cranking and it started running ragged. He let off the throttle and it settled into a rough idle that cleared up in a few seconds. Killed it and it fired right back up. They went ahead and took it back into the shop and ran diagnosis on it and could find nothing wrong.

It went a year or more before that happened again. Remembering what he had done I used the same method to get it started. It has happened a few more times over the years. A bit of a pain when it does but I've always been able to get it going. Friends have reported the same thing happening to them.

I've also had my 06 400 do the same thing.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I have had it start a couple of times in the past & needed to burb the throttle to help it out keep running but nothing like this. I think I bought a new battery for nothing. :(
 

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how weird a similar thread on the FJR forum - almost identical symptoms - they referred to it as a Semi-flooded Syndrome.
Basically as was the case on old carb cars. if you flooded it, open throttle, put choke in and crank - Would start 99% of the time.

Basically they are saying the ecu thinks the bike has started and is warm and so doesn't inject enough fuel so it wont start when cold - the pre-conditions are not always the same - so there didn't seem to be a way to "prevent it"

Here the relevant extract

" Some things have been noted around a no-start incident like parking the bike when real hot then not riding it for weeks, starting the bike then immediately shutting it off, a weak but not bad battery. "

and

"Your fjr has both an Intake Air Pressure sensor located at the left end of the TB rack and an Ambient Air Pressure sensor. .... The ECU looks at the difference between the two sensors to derive one of the 'terms' used by the software to trim the fuel injection shots. "

It may not be the same issue but certainly the same sort of symptoms
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Never had my 400 do it. Guess I have another thing I can add to my 650 knowledge base. :D
 

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Never had my 400 do it. Guess I have another thing I can add to my 650 knowledge base. :D
You may have just been lucky. I know of a 08 400 that did the same thing.
 

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Because today fuel is so bad, I always run premium fuel, StaBil additive in the fuel, and an injector cleaner every couple of months to a tank of fuel. Now I have no idea if the fuel is causing this problem or not, but for me it's just the way I treat my motorcycles/scooters. It does cost a little more, but it just the way I run my fuel injected bikes and have had no problems. I would say it's a fuel injector problem somewhere, the fuel, or the fuel programmer is not working properly.

John
 

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Because today fuel is so bad, I always run premium fuel, StaBil additive in the fuel, and an injector cleaner every couple of months to a tank of fuel. Now I have no idea if the fuel is causing this problem or not, but for me it's just the way I treat my motorcycles/scooters. It does cost a little more, but it just the way I run my fuel injected bikes and have had no problems. I would say it's a fuel injector problem somewhere, the fuel, or the fuel programmer is not working properly.

John

How you liking the scoot John? Mine is in the garage wondering when it will be nice enough to go for a ride. I say Thursday, Friday at the latest.
 

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Sharkey, I really like it, Piglet told me how well you liked your Burgman, I guess that help me with my decision to purchase one, hope to get to some TWT MG&E's when the weather gets better.

John
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Mine never sits long enough to add any fuel additive. Being down for a week waiting on a new battery that I didn't need is about as long as it ever sits.:D
 

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I use only ethanol-free premium fuel from a local station for my 08 650 and 71 Karmann Ghia. I don't use any additives over the winter and both are parked for at least 4 months since neither has a heater. And the 650 has never balked at startup after sitting for a time. This is the first winter for the Ghia to sit. I did run the carbs completely out of fuel.
 

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I honestly do not believe this is a fuel quality, fuel contamination or injector problem.
 

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I agree with Norman. More than likely it has something to do with the sensors and/or ECM mapping.
 

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Hmmmm... I get rides from a local source who drives a Karmann Ghia. The heater will roast you! Checked your engine heat transfer tubes lately? They are most likely rotted out and you just need new ones. (Old Beetles had the same problem and fix.)

Kim
 

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It is a cold start, over rich condition.

When you cold start the bike is set to run very rich, till warmed up, to compensate for a reasonably good idle while cold, and during cold start, all FI do this.

I have the same problem with my Toyota, if I try to start it and dont completely get it started it is like it floods.

Then you need to open throttle to full, then start, and crank engine till started, then it will run a little rough till over rich has run through engine.
 

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I have also expereinced weird starts. Cranked some and then acted like it was not going to run (very rough, funny sound, etc.). Then finally cleared up. I think that has hapened four or five times in 4 years. I ride a lot, so it is not due to sitting or short trips. It seldom sits more than a couple days (73400 miles in 4 1/2 years).

That said, I have never changed plugs or adjusted valves (runs like a top, same gas mileage all these years and miles). Dead now due to either clutch or CVT (will not pull, but engine runs OK) Posted about this on another topic (just saying).

Here is one a bit diferent. Friend in MI that comes thru here (TN) every fall on the way to FL for the winter in their RV (hauls his 2009 Burgman 650 with him). Last year when he got here and unloaded it, he was going to show a friend how cool it was starting. It started, raan rough and died. Could not restart. He called me and I hauled him to the local dealer figuring the worse for hom (new ECM, $900 or so or who knows what).

They called him back in a couple hours and said - Spark Plugs were fouled. $100 total.

They said, "Spark plugs get fouled by folks starting bike and not running it long enough to get hot." My friend said, "Could be cause sometiems at home he starts it to move it and does not go on a ride." WHO KNOWS.
 
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