[redbird 2]

Hi Guy's,I am from the UK. A Merry old Christmas to you one and all.Now that is over can you guy's that have the Burgaman 650 tell me how long the drive belts last before they need changing. The Honda SilverWing has to change theirs at 12k. What do you think.

redbird 2

 

[ajwood]

Suzuki Service manual clocks the $411 CVT belt in at 14,500 miles.

Near clean room conditions are required to open up the cases and the book states that the belt should never be handled with ones hands.

 

[roy_ryall]

I think the belt on the 650 is good for the expected live of the bike.

 

[ajwood]

I think the belt on the 650 is good for the expected live of the bike.

I can't figure out why, when there's a discussion about the life expectancy of an AN650 CVT belt, that I always get the guy who say's that it should last for the "life" of the bike, whatever that means.
The book says 14,500 and there's not an owner on this board that has enough miles on their bike to disprove it.

Suzuki's Skywave/Burgman designers must have asked the belt manufacturer what their tests proved in order to come up with a realistic number to publish in Suzuki's own manual.
And that number is there at least two reasons:
To prevent catastrophic failures of the belt/CVT in order to save human lives and keep the Suzuki legal department out of product liability suits.
Unless Suzuki or the belt manufacturer says otherwise, I'm going to be checking out the CVT disassembly section of the service manual just before the specified interval.

 

[allwalk]

I guess we won't be able to honestly tell untill someone has reached this milestone (pun intended) and does the service work. If they do it themselves and have a new belt with them to compare to, then maybe we will have some answers. With only 1200kms on mine and stored for the winter I know it won't be me :wink: I will be watching for future reference to this situation.

 

[roy_ryall]

ajwood, I do not would to start an argument, however, I think this information is important to potential 650 owners so I am replying to clarify the difference in the sources of our information.

I rechecked the routine maintenance schedule of the Suzuki 650 Service Manual I have a copy of and unless I missed it, it does not mention the CVT belt. I do not have a 650 owner's manual any more so I can not look at it, but I would expect the shop service manual to have it in its table. I also looked it the CVT disassembly section of the service manual and did not see any reference to the 14,500 miles.

Maybe I missed it or I have the wrong service manual. Could direct me to the page.

Out of curiosity, I did look at a copy of the routine maintenance schedule for the 400 and it recommends replacement of the Drive V-belt at 14,500 miles.

The use of "the expected live of the bike", is just a generalized expression that most owners will not put enough miles on the bike to have the part fail. How long does the engine or a transmission last? I would guess most last "the expected life of vehicle".

 

[allwalk]

Hey there Roy !
After reading your post I looked in my 650 manual that came with my machine.It mentions to inspect the CVT filter at 7500 miles and at 15000miles. There is no mention of the CVT belt inspection or replacement whatsoever. I don't have a hard copy of the service manual so I can't comment what it says.

 

[ajwood]

Hey Roy,

I've confused some other item at 12,500 after looking at the section myself. A friend of a friend grapevined the milage info to me all wrong.

Now that I've found out why a life expectancy post always follows any bogus 12,500 belt post, we'll just have to argue another point!

Bonus Point: Which page in the owners book does Suzuki state that the life expectancy of the machine is 18,500 miles?

I'll probably get mine paid off by 18,500.

 

[Guest]

[No message]

 

[allwalk]

I plan on doing that work myself. I was looking at the pdf manual in regards to this subject and it means complete removal of the engine and splitting the cases to get at the CVT belt. If I go through all this hassle I will have a replacement belt on hand anyway. I'm not going through all that work and not replacing something. I will definetely save this maintenance service as a winter project.

 

[Zook650]

Re the CVT belts.

Ok, we have 20000 k's up on our 2002 650. I have the full workshop manual and the is NO reference to the life of the belt. The only thing to check is the CVT filter. However, there is a passage that says, "let oil pressure get to the transmission before riding otherwise damage to the CVT CAN occur". In other words, don't start and go. Other than that, unless someone hears from Suzuki, the belt should last the life of the bike ( 200000 k's ?????). Cheers Geoff

 

[ajwood]

So true Covert, about the disposable motorcycle mindset out there.

I've gotta admit that when touring on the '96 Nighthawk 750 in 1999, I kept it unwashed so it wouldn't attract thieves at motels which didn't give a view of the bike out in some parking lot.
This gave one more use out of PJ1, to hide new tires and sprockets and also give the license plate a 4x4 look.

Periodically I would dress the chain with Bel-Ray 6in1 moly based spray oil that would clean the gunk out of the rollers and plates while lubing the insides. I gained greater than 20,000 miles out of a chain just by Bel-Ray-ing in the morning then PJ-ing in the afternoon every few days while crossing the US.

It took a while to appreciate the Won't Fly Off claim on the PJ label by learning to apply it upon a trip return, just before parking overnight. Then it wouldn't fly off on the next days ride. Most of it wouldn't.

Bye-bye PJ1.
My Burgman, hands and gloves are cleaner without having to use an interstate highway Rest Stop parking lot to lube a cycle chain... And don't forget to walk all the way back into the restroom to wash the dirt and PJ off before taking off again on a chain drive bike.
Out on the road for 2-3 weeks? Use a gas station/motel/restaurant parking lot to both lube and adjust the chain.

This is what I thought centerstands were for:
To put the rear wheel into idle engine speed so the chain would take lube while the PJ nozzle pointed towards the Left plate then the Right plate then the roller Center as the wheel spun around.

A good quality chain for a CB750LT costs about $160 anyway.
That's only 1/3 less (eeek).
If I can time the AN650 service intervals of both shims and belt in the same tear-down job, I'll be alright. That's every other shim adjust.
If someone else would play endurance guinea pig for us, that would help too. Maybe there's a performance difference nearing the end of a CVT belt's life like slipping or whining.

 

[tony17112acst]

When I was looking at the 650 (before I got my 400), I was told by the dealer here in Harrisburg, PA that the belt does not need changed. I then said why not? He then said that the belt wasn't like a regular/common scooter belt and that it was made up of different materials altogether as well. He also made it sound like a chain with individual links in it (somehow ???).

I took his word for it at the time, and I have yet to hear any contrary evidence from the shop manual/owner's manual that it needs changed (so far).

I took it as a part that only needed replaced when it broke. Kind of like a water pump on a car. There's really no life expectancy; it could last 50,000 miles or 200,000 miles. You just replace it if it ever goes bad.

Just thought I'd pass that info on that I got from the dealership.

 

[Roger Buente]

CVT mileage

I read my manual last night and can find no reference to a specific mileage to change the belt, only the aforementioned CVT filter checks. If this is a state of the art CVT such as the one in my Honda Insight then it should last for a very long time. I also read the section on replacing the belt and the way I read it is that the transmission is unbolted from the engine once the engine is removed but you do not split the engine cases. The transmission comes out as a unit and then you split it to get to the belt. It looks like it requires some special tools so I hope I don't ever have to attempt it.

 

[pauljo]

What concerns me is that if the belt does break, it is probably not going to happen in your garage or driveway. It will probably happen some distance away from home (and away from a scooter-savvy Suzuki dealership). And this sure doesn't sound like a reasonable roadside repair, so carrying a spare isn't a viable option. If there is an anticipated life span for the belt, I'd think we deserve to know it. Belts can last a long time, but I've never heard of a belt that will last forever.

Paul

 

[rich b]

belts

the life expectancy of the belt is 20,000-30,000 km,or about 14,000-20,000 miles. moreover the lifespan of the secvt unit is at least 100,000 km ,or about 65,000 miles.the confusion regarding life time of the final drive being life of the bike is that the final drive on most scooters is a belt but on the burgman 650 ,is a set of 5 gears ,that run encased in the left side swingarm those 5 gears should last the life of the bike,NOT THE BELT the information regarding belt,& secvt life came from suzuki engineers at the japanese introduction of the skywave 650 (what we call our burgman 650)& can be found in a translated article at http://www.bigscooter.com/staff/tora/sw650/index_e.html
i hope this clears up some of the confusion & speculation on this for you.the manual doesn't say, the dealers can guess? i would think the suzuki design engineer spokesman ,is about the best authority you can rely on?

 

[rich b]

belts

i would like to alay some of the fears i have heard about the belt breaking & leaving one stranded without warning ,etc. this dry hybrid belt is not a conventional belt construction. it is much stronger in regards to breaking ,due mostly to it's alluminum links. where conventional belts of rubber & cord do often break the burger 650 should simply wear out a slow death ,giving the owner plenty of warning time. warning signs would include lower top speed in each gear ratio,due to the belt narrowing & going deeper into the pulley grooves (which changes effective diameter) or ratio. & finaly if you fail to notice this slow gradual change,the point will probably come where the belt slides down so far in the grooves that it starts to bottom on the pulleys & slippage will start to occur esp.at take off or you may feel some chattering in the driveline. do yourself a favor & don't overlook these warning signs. changing the belt is expensive enough. not changing a badly worn belt could damage the pulleys or even the secvt unit itself were the belt to break ,& start whipping around in the case. play it safe ,be aware, & never let it get to that point. good luck. Rich B

 

[roy_ryall]

Rich, it "may" explain the belt life. I read the article and would offer a few observations. 1) The comment on the belt life is second hand reporting. 2) The author did not identify the person giving the info as a "Suzuki design engineer". 3) This was apparently the first public showing of the bike and did the person giving out the info get it correct or did he get it confused. 4) When anyone quotes a CVT belt replacement mileage for the 650, it is similar the replacement mileage for the 400 drive belt.

The Suzuki site referenced in the article only provided the following info on the CVT belt life (translator error "the sea bass" ??).

"Long life was actualized
Dry hybrid belt

One dry hybrid belt of new technology of the sea bass is adopted for this SECVT. It constitutes due to the tension member of the heatproof rubber make which uses the H type block and the aramide fiber 204 with the strengthening aluminum alloy which resin coating is done it was made. By the fact that H type block and the tension member are used for the contact area of the pulley, long life was actualized, the lubrication by oil made unnecessary."

Until Suzuki releases some official info or someone has to replace the belt, we will not know for sure. I guess it comes down to a matter of what info you want to believe and a "best guess". I think I will continue believe Suzuki would not put out a MC that requires a very expensive replacement at a low mileage. However, if the CVT belt life is 14,000 to 20,000 miles and the cost of replacing is as high as expected, there will be a lot 650s for sell, both new and used.

 

[allwalk]

Well this is one of those not seen problems you must deal with when buying a first year product. There are so many unanswered questions. No one will really know untill people put enough mileage on the machine or heaven forbid , break a belt. With this said the only other statement I can make is " MY 650 IS NOT FOR SALE"

 

[redbird 2]

The drive belt

Hi Guy's
I trust you had a good thank's giving.
The drive belt on the Burgman 650 is like no other drive belt on these :auto scooters:. I am told that it has steel ribs in the belt and that you must not touch it with your hands if you do have to replace it.I am asured by Susuki that it will last a very long time,6 times longer than an ordinary rubber drive belt.After the second recall on the Silverwing I have made my mind up and am going for a Burgman650,at least it will not come apart while I am on it .

redbird 2