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Discussion Starter #1
Long story short I finally got my bike torn apart to put a new CVT belt on. To the best of my knowledge it's the original belt from 07 and I have about 22,000 miles on it right now (all but 6600 done me too). The belt was actually in good shape despite some cracking and wear. However the clutch was shot according to the mechanic. I have some pics of it but am unsure how to post the pics :oops: (I will post them to my blog later).

The good news is the rest of the bike is in good shape. The brakes are in good shape, the drive chain oil was replaced. I'm happy about that.

But I need to replace the clutch. Any idea what a new clutch might run? Or is a used clutch OK. I was quoted a price that I thought was a little high (to put is mildly) and want to see if they were in the ball park for a new clutch + labor.
 

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As for the Adige SU-84. It depends on whether you have the 2007- or 2007+ model. If you needed the $150 belt then you have a 2007+ (larger wheels, 5 shoe clutch w/larger bell, expensive belt, some ventilation mods to the CVT) and the Adige is not going to work. If you have the 2007- (pre 'upgrade', $90 belt, 3 shoe clutch) the Adige will work fine.

If you go with an OEM clutch, it's around $150 or so. If you go with the Dr Pulley HIT clutch, its around $400. That's for parts.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Chatman128 said:
As for the Adige SU-84. It depends on whether you have the 2007- or 2007+ model. If you needed the $150 belt then you have a 2007+ (larger wheels, 5 shoe clutch w/larger bell, expensive belt, some ventilation mods to the CVT) and the Adige is not going to work. If you have the 2007- (pre 'upgrade', $90 belt, 3 shoe clutch) the Adige will work fine.

If you go with an OEM clutch, it's around $150 or so. If you go with the Dr Pulley HIT clutch, its around $400. That's for parts.
I have the 2007 "400 AN" model. To the best of my knowledge that is the only model for that year. I was quoted the HIT clutch price + labor which frankly I can't afford. :(
 

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Adige and some vendors list the SU-84 as working with the '07+ 400s however it will not (this is from their catalog):



The SU-84 has an OD of 147 mm so as to work with the 150 mm ID clutch bell of the earlier models--the '07+ clutch bell has a 160 mm ID.
 

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Houndguy said:
Chatman128 said:
As for the Adige SU-84. It depends on whether you have the 2007- or 2007+ model. If you needed the $150 belt then you have a 2007+ (larger wheels, 5 shoe clutch w/larger bell, expensive belt, some ventilation mods to the CVT) and the Adige is not going to work. If you have the 2007- (pre 'upgrade', $90 belt, 3 shoe clutch) the Adige will work fine.

If you go with an OEM clutch, it's around $150 or so. If you go with the Dr Pulley HIT clutch, its around $400. That's for parts.
I have the 2007 "400 AN" model. To the best of my knowledge that is the only model for that year. I was quoted the HIT clutch price + labor which frankly I can't afford. :(
If you don't mind me asking...what did they quote you?
 

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cliffyk said:
Adige and some vendors list the SU-84 as working with the '07+ 400s however it will not (this is from their catalog):



The SU-84 has an OD of 147 mm so as to work with the 150 mm ID clutch bell of the earlier models--the '07+ clutch bell has a 160 mm ID.
I emailed Adige and was told by them that they do not produce a clutch to fit the 2007 and later model. So as cliffyk wrote, the clutch does not fit, even if you see a listing at a website.

The Dr. Pulley HiT clutch works extremely well on my 400. It will probably last the lifetime of the bike. However, I have the earlier model. I offered to try working with the newer model HiT clutch from joes4570's 400 and couldn't get it to work well enough to recommend it to anyone. Paul Wu was very good about trying to make his product good for Joe, but I don't know what the result was after the clutch pads were replaced. It seems the newer model clutch works well for some...and not for others.

If I was to replace a clutch today, I'd probably go with the OEM clutch from Boulevard Suzuki. Price is about $135 plus shipping. More expensive than the Adige clutch, and less than the HiT clutch...but you know it'll work.

Chris
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Deedah said:
If you don't mind me asking...what did they quote you?
They quoted me the Dr Pully HIT Clutch price of $400 + labor. So I am looking at a $500 - $600 bill.

Well I don't see it being that unreasonable (Dr Pully is quality after all) I also hope to do a little better.
 

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ive just started reading this thread and although im a big fan of the dr pulley products and recently installed the 19g sliders with great results, i have not heard alot of positive benefits by replacing the clutch pack with the dr pulley HIT version. i read some posts from a few months ago that just werent very favorable considering the cost of the **** thing !

i have a honda ruckus with a swapped 150 motor in it and the dr pulley HIT clutch for that setup and i really dont think it was worth it either, i mean it looks cool ( the cvt on my ruck is open and viewable ) but thats about it. i dont get better or smoother performance from it even after plying with the zillions of spring combos that the kit comes with....

so....IMHO....i would pass on the HIT clutch....
 

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I don't know whether or not I have a older HiT or the newer style, all I know is I've had more pains with it than I can express. Right now (ok, the last time I rode in September) it worked OK - nothing spetacular. I doubt that I would ever get another one. It seemed that once I got the springs set, after a month or less, the same problems would reappear and the only "solution" was to try harder and harder springs. If I wanted to have a high RPM takeoff I would have stuck with the OEM. I've got stock to heaver springs in there now just to keep it from juddering - that's not supposed to have to be done.

Why did I try the HiT? Simple, my OEM was slipping so bad, especially when wet, but the dealer said that was normal (guess who I won't recommend for service). The clutch was a bit glazed, but even with deglazing and proper start-off procedures, I still had problems.

Now, maybe if I weighed 150 pounds that would be different.

However, I do like the sliders (as compared to the rollers).
 

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This is not a HIT clutch specific issue, however I have seen a lot of discussion regarding lowering the engine rpm at clutch engagement, and would like to comment about same. Also I apologise for sounding like a university professor. Problem is that I cannot help it as for a period in my career I was.

A dominate issue is that with a single cylinder engine the pulses of the power stroke become more noticeable as engine RPM is reduced. I spoke of this in another thread recently. The angular velocity of the crankshaft's rotation is not a nice smooth homogeneous flow, but rather a significant accelerative "kick" on the power stroke, followed by a rather tame and steady rotation during the exhaust and intake strokes, and then a deceleration and sort of a struggle during the compression stroke. For a variety of reasons (inertia/flywheel effect of the rotational mass mostly) as the crankshaft sped is increased these dramatic changes in angular velocity become less forceful and more tolerable--it is for this reason that reducing the engine speed at engagement of any centrifugal clutch on out scoots may not be a more desirable thing.

At 3000 rpm the power pulses occur at 40 mS intervals, meaning the centrifugal clutch will grab and release (in concert with the crankshaft's acceleration/deceleration) at 25 Hz. At 4000 RPM the grab and release cycle will be at 30 ms intervals, 33.33 Hz, a frequency less palpable for we humans and one that reduces the duration of the clutch pad's transfer of torque to the clutch bell. Time X torque = power, however less torque transferred more frequently results in the same overall power transmission, just in a more pleasurable manner. I.e. it is a softer application of the clutch.

One other issue I would like to address since we are talking about clutches is that of the "glazing" of the clutch pads. There is much confusion regarding polishing/burnishing of the pads and bell and true glazing. The latter, glazing, is just as the term implies if applied to ceramics. I.e. that heat has been applied in sufficient quantity over sufficient time to fuse the components of the "glazed" materials into a hardened solidified mass, quite different and distinct from the original material. Those of us old enough the remember drum brakes are quite familiar with true honest to "G" glazing. You could smell it in the cab when it happened and when you pulled the drums pieces of decomposed brake shoe chipped away and fell to the floor. Clutches did this too, literally burning during the transition phase.

What has been referred to as glazing in many of the posts herein has not been glazing, but rather just a polishing/burnishing of the contact surface on the clutch pads; that one would expect from the normal mating of the pads and clutch bell (there was a thread about this earlier that faded away). The surface of the pad material has not been compositionally altered, just polished by its contact with the bell--that is not glazing...
 

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When I needed to swap my clutch out on my 2007 400, I had some competing factors to consider that may be relevant here.
1. The OEM clutch on many 2007 and 2008s was making noise. I had been lucky for 33,000 miles. Would I be so lucky next time. There was no guarantee.
2. Cost. The OEM clutch was inexpensive in comparison with the Dr. Pulley HiT clutch. The Malossi clutch was inbetween for cost, but was also the same technology as the OEM clutch...and the Malossi clutch was squealing on a member's 400.

So the tradeoff was to pay more for the HiT clutch with a guarantee of not having any squealing problems, or to buy an OEM/Malossi clutch for less and potentially still go with the HiT clutch if it did squeal. I chose the HiT clutch and haven't been sorry.

The HiT clutch...if it is working properly...locks up smoothly at a low rpm (2800 rpms) as you're accelerating. The effect in my mind, is that of a manual transmission and clutch. It engages...you accelerate. No lag to 15 mph. No fuss or bother. And that's the way it works on mine. Another benefit that I didn't realize till years later, is it isn't wearing out. I have 44,000 miles on my HiT clutch and it still looks almost like new. It may be the only clutch I put on the 2008 400. If I had bought an OEM clutch, I'd be on my second.

However, the second generation HiT clutch is one I can't recommend. I don't have it, and when I was trying to find a spring combination for joes4570 using his second generation HiT clutch, I got the same symptoms that happytech has experienced. I thought it would be the spring combination, but I went from the strongest to the default and experienced no change whatsoever. I wish I had cliffyk's experience, but IMHO, the pad material slips and grabs repeatedly. happytech and joes4570 are on the close side of 300 lbs; I'm at 190 and it didn't make a difference. It may work great for you...many have. But it may also act up for you and you're out a lot of $$$ in that case.

If you put on a lot of miles commuting or touring, this may be the clutch for you though. If it works, then it'll last potentially for the life of the bike. If you are like many owners and only put a couple thousand miles on a year, then the extra cost would probably be a waste of money. You'd never wear out the OEM clutch. If you bought it then, it would be for the performance when starting from a standing stop. In other words, no lag in acceleration.

Chris
 

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Daboo said:
Happytech and joes4570 are on the close side of 300 lbs.
Thanks pal - until surgery had lain me up, I was closer to around 220/225.

Bruce
 

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Ooops! :oops: :oops: :oops:

Chris
 

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Does the less expensive stock clutch work? Sure, that's what was in there originally.
Does the more expensive aftermarket clutch do anything 4x as well? I doubt it.
 

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I have the HIt clutch. Don"t know if it is the new or old (got mine two years ago) but it works like a dream. What is the difference between the old vs. new HIT?
 

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Buy a oem clutch from someone that has replaced theirs with a HIT clutch. That's what I did. A 08, or 09 will fit your 07 as I replaced mine with a 09 which works fine. :thumbup:

PM one of the members that has a HIT clutch they might be looking for some extra cash to get rid of their stock one. :wink:
 

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I would say save your money---Suzuki figured out what works for the Burgman 400----want more or different performance, buy a motorcycle. I think if you ride a lot, stock works fine----my experience after over 250,000 rubber band scooter miles.
 

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I just turned 41k, change oil time, checked the clutch shoes (mirror & flashlight) and still have more than 1/8" to go. I ride 20 miles to work, generally get caught at 2 stop lights, go straight to 4K rpm on startoff, but I am getting crazy mileage out of the stock clutch.

I have changed belts 1 time I think, and check the clutch shoes everytime I am in the CVT, blow the dust out, general routiene maintenance.

Bob Weis
 
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