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I see in other countries that the people seem to have been satisfied with 250cc or smaller scooters but here in the USA 400 - 600 is often spoken of as minimal for highway use ( one rider ) and around town. Are they right and we are just obcessed with power ?
 

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I think it depends a lot on the person and the type of riding you do. If my usage was strictly city or rural roads, a 250 would be fine. If I were touring with luggage, pulling a trailer, or riding mostly 2 up, I probably get the 650. My 400 is a great bike for the kind of riding I currently do which is a mix of city, rural roads, and interstate. There have been a few instances when I wish I had the 650 single riding. Those are mostly when passing on 2 lane roads so aI could get around the vehicle a bit quicker. The other is so I could show a Harley rider exactly what a scooter can do. ;)

Yes. I am (a bit) obsessed with power. :)
 

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When was the last time you you bought something that was not "New and Improved" or " Super Duty" or
"extra strong" . Every time we turn around we are being told "Bigger/faster is Better" and we begin to believe it.
There is no one bike or scooter that will do it all .
The way I see it, it's not if the bike I am riding is the right bike--it's how often it's the wrong bike.
So far my 400 has been the right choice more often then any other bike I have owned :)
 

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Dad said:
I see in other countries that the people seem to have been satisfied with 250cc or smaller scooters but here in the USA 400 - 600 is often spoken of as minimal for highway use ( one rider ) and around town. Are they right and we are just obcessed with power ?
My first scooter was a CH125 (Honda Elite 125). I was around 190 pounds back then (220 now), and it just wasn't able to take me where I wanted to go without straining itself.

So I traded it for a CH250. At the time I think it was the biggest scooter sold in America. That was a lot better, but the added power also encouraged me to ride longer distances on the freeway...and it was barely able to do that.

So when I decided to get a bike again I knew it would have to be bigger than a 250. So I looked at the Reflex, Silverwing, Burgman 400, and Burgman 650. I got the 650.

It's not that I'm obsessed with power; it's that for the kind I riding I do it's a better compromise for me than any of the others. YMMV.
 

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Power is never too much, just like money, the more the better.
I've been riding since 1985, my 1st bike was a 150 Honda Elite.
I was still in high school working part time at a gas station.
So the 150 Elite was perfect for me, using it to & from work
in the city (15 min each way)Cheap on gas & insurance.
$3.00 gas will last me all week.
 

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We've been to Europe four times in the last five years and I don't recall seeing scooters on the highways- motorcycles yes, but not scooters. There are thousands of scooters in the cities however and the riders apparently prefer them small, maneuverable and quick. They often ride between the car lanes (making 5 lanes out of a two lane one-way street for instance) and generally pass around and between the cars to get in front at stop lights. They blast off ahead of the cars when the light changes and then do the same thing at the next light. I think we'd get killed if we tried that over here. I did see a Burg 650 early one afternoon this summer in central Rome. It was parked with a bunch of motorcycles in front of an upscale living complex and I doubt that it's used as a commuting scoot.

Frank- still looking and reading.
 

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Bill, wrote

"If I were touring with luggage, pulling a trailer, or riding mostly 2 up, I probably get the 650. There have been a few instances when I wish I had the 650 single riding. Those are mostly when passing on 2 lane roads so aI could get around the vehicle a bit quicker. The other is so I could show a Harley rider exactly what a scooter can do."

It is the same for me.


Stormsteed, wrote

"Could it be that other countries don't deal with semis and trucks of the size we have here, not to mention the number of highway lanes and volume of traffic?"

A 400 can deal those conditions without a trouble.


How do you make those quote boxes?
 

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roy_ryall said:
How do you make those quote boxes?
You click on the "Quote" button in the upper right corner of the post you want to quote from, and the person's quote appears in your new reply box.

Delete any part you don't want included, and add your text after the quote.

With experience you can post multiple quotes and divide portions of quotes with your own commentary, but that requires retyping or copying the quote codes.

For example, to get your question "How do you make those quote boxes?" to appear in a quote box, I clicked on the quote button in your post and this appeared:

roy_ryall said:
Bill, wrote

"If I were touring with luggage, pulling a trailer, or riding mostly 2 up, I probably get the 650. There have been a few instances when I wish I had the 650 single riding. Those are mostly when passing on 2 lane roads so aI could get around the vehicle a bit quicker. The other is so I could show a Harley rider exactly what a scooter can do."

It is the same for me.


Stormsteed, wrote

"Could it be that other countries don't deal with semis and trucks of the size we have here, not to mention the number of highway lanes and volume of traffic?"

A 400 can deal those conditions without a trouble.


How do you make those quote boxes?
Then I just deleted all but your last line, which was the question I'm dealing with here.

Getting the actual code to appear in this post, rather than a quote box, is a whole different matter, and I won't go into it here. Too geeky. :D
 

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Dad said:
I see in other countries that the people seem to have been satisfied with 250cc or smaller scooters but here in the USA 400 - 600 is often spoken of as minimal for highway use ( one rider ) and around town. Are they right and we are just obcessed with power ?
There are a number of riders who seem to be obcessed with power but most I know say they buy bikes based on what they like to ride or what they need and not just engine size. I started on a 400 Yamaha because I felt that was what I needed (and could handle) when I first started riding. I graduated to a Goldwing in '80 because my needs had changed, not necessarily because I needed 1100 cc's. I bought a new '83 Venture 1200 and a new '96 1500 Wing mainly because of the more modern technology, not because I needed more power. I had a number of other's in the 800 to 1100 cc range as second bikes but only because I liked that particular bike and not because of engine size.
Now, at age 65, my needs have changed again so I bought my 650 Burgman. I liked the styling, the comfort, the performance and the auto transmission. The engine size didn't really enter into it although I did feel it was more suited to my size and riding style than the 400.
Remember that a lot of us are downsizing to the Burgmans from larger displacement bikes. While a 400 or 650 looks like a lot of power if you're upsizing from a 50, 125 or even a 250 or you're a new rider, for those of us downsizing you're probably correct that we consider a 400 or 600 minimal for highway use. Believe me, we're not buying 400s or 650s because we're "obcessed with power" - it's only that we know what's required for our riding needs and styles. :D
 

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fcatwo said:
We've been to Europe four times in the last five years and I don't recall seeing scooters on the highways- motorcycles yes, but not scooters.
I was passed by a Burgman 400 (2 up) on the Autostrada near Trieste last summer.
 

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Don’t confuse top speed with power. Most folks would not feel safe in an auto that could barely keep up with highway traffic and left no reserve power available. My Honda Reflex 250 was just this type of animal.

Depending on headwinds, I was not able to go with the flow at highway speeds. And I was not able to pull out in some instances unless I had a lot of room to gain speed.

My 650 obviously takes care of these issues well. The added weight also serves well to limit wind turbulence.
 

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Hello all, I'm new here and have read almost everything that has been said here about the Bergman Scooters. I would have one by now if my local Dealer could have found a 2004 in Silver. My first wife's cousin by marriage owns the Paris Suzuki Dealership and told me this weekend that they had one on display at the Dealers Show last month in red. And Suzuki querried the Dealers as to what color they'd like to sell. Allmost everyoe said "Yellow". My preffered color choice. So, I decided this weekend to wait the three weeks and see what the 2005's look like before I order mine. We live in Rhome, Texas and are looking forward to putzing around the country roads on ours. We also motorhome around the country and feel the Bergmans would make an excellent scooter take with us for riding around and exploring on. Heck, I've almst got my Significant Other (2nd wife) convinced she could handle and enjoy her own. Since she's small in stature and I'm twice her size we'll most likely have a 400 and 650 in our stables before long. She had a ball at the dealership Saturday sizing up the 400. She doesn't do the clutch thing well ,so the automatic apeals the her!
Like many of you I've been riding Scooters and Motorcycles all my life. Dad had garage full of Vespa, Lambrettas and Cushmans while I was growing up in the 50"s. He was wanting a Helix in his 70's, up until the day he died. So now you know where my love for scooters comes from. After crashing my crotch rocket last summer (see below), I finally asked myself something. "Why in the world do I need to go warp speed at my age????????" Being without 2 wheel transportation for 12 month has made me NUTS tho. I love to ride. Far, short, twisty, straight line, fast or slow. I don't care! I just gotta get me another machine.
Having done a lot of research on just what size bike I really would be happiest on, I decided on the AN 650. I'm about 6 feet tall and 240 lbs so a 250 would be fine if all I wanted to do was visit the neighbors up the road. But, since the closest town to me is 8 miles of twisty road (This is the main reason I bought this house in the Country) and the oil field trucks are blasting up and down them all day and night, I got to have something that will get out of the way of the Rock Trucks. We just need something that would be the best all around machine for us.
I think if the Bergman came in 1000 cc We probably wouldn't buy it. A 650 is plenty of power for most riding for anything but serious full time touring. The 400 Bergman is too small frame wise for me so it's out. And, the 650 has plenty of room for my long legs. (I hate feeling like I'm a circus clown.)

So how much is enough? I think it has to do more with the average size of your average American riders verses the Foriegn guys. And let's not forget the distances and conditions we are riding in. Sure, there are large frame European riders, but , over all, they tend to be a little smaller frame. That maybe why the Harley Brand Bikes have survived as long in the U.S. as they have. They cater to the BIG Man better. Or big Ego perhaps! :lol:
We can't wait til next year to ride to the Scootercade! 8)

Looking forward to geting to know ya'll and meeting as many as I can.
I actually have already talked to John Jacobs on the phone, so I'm getting started on that.

Three weeks and counting!

Curtis J
 

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Curtis,

Welcome to BurgmanUSA. Excellent first post! I really enjoyed reading it.

Do go to Scootercade next year if you can - it is a great experience. You won't find a more friendly rally crowd anywhere. I'll be going again if it is at all possible.

Yellow would be an awesome color for the Burgman! My V-Strom is yellow, and I absolutely love it in that color. It really stands out to other motorists, so it is a great defensive option.

Keep us posted on your progress with buying the scooter, and on how well it lives up to your expectations. I'm betting that you will find it right on the mark - and maybe even better than you anticipated.
 

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Curtis,

Welcome to the BurgmanUSA forums! Glad to have another soon to be Burgman rider in out midst. I believe you'll be very happy you made the decision to get a Burgman. You might suggest to your wife to look thru the forums too. She'll find some very good info post by the ladies of the forums.
 

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Thanks for the welcome Billjo, Seatec and BillMeek. I've been lurking here for about two weeks and find that there is a very supportive attitude here. Very refreshing. I'm sure we'll create some great friendships here.
Melissa and I love to enjoy the adventure life has to give. There's no guarentee that tomorrow will every come. I'm a compulsive tinkerer / fabricator and can't leave things alone. The wife understands that nothing mechanical is sacred around me. I'm looking forward to exploring the possible mods I can build for the Bergman. So don't be surprised!

More than likely for 2 up riding the 650 will be more than enough. Every thing I've read here supports that. My Harley riding buddy still has a puzzeled look on his face.(I showed him the Brochure. :lol:) He has been chasing me for years on his HOG and I know he's thinking, "At last he'll be able to keep up". Even my custom 800 Intruder left him in the dust. :D

Will post up when I get my order in.

Later,Curtis J
 

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Curtis J said:
I'm a compulsive tinkerer / fabricator and can't leave things alone. The wife understands that nothing mechanical is sacred around me. I'm looking forward to exploring the possible mods I can build for the Bergman. So don't be surprised!
Looking forward to seeing the mods you come up with. Always like seeing new and interesting ideas for the Burgmans.
 
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