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We do have to give him credit for doing it himself .... he could have just put a for sale sign on it and moved it on down the road. The new buyer would have joined here and been crying about how Burgmans are a POS. 馃槂

Kudos ! 7milesout
 
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Discussion Starter #42
bcalan - I got a chuckle. As I consider what I'm doing, the lazy man's way. This crap is already taken apart to figure out what is wrong. All I have to do is swap a few part and bolt it back together. The only thing I may have trouble with is driving the new bearing back in place. It is as easy as that. However, I'm going to spend some time cleaning up inside the FD, and lubing it up as much as I can. There will be a mess on the floor when I'm done.

I think taking the whole thing off is more work than what I'm doing. More work, and likely more complex than what is being explained to me. In my experience, things are always more difficult than they seem. I've gotten to where I am on this FD, all I have to do is reverse it, and it was easy to get where I am.

As for driving that bearing, at the least, I think I can start it, then use the cover and that #2 gear, and screw it back together to finish driving the bearing in. Then take the cover back off, check its position, and the free spinning of the gear. Then slap all pieces and parts back in, put the cover back in and proceed to do big smoky burnouts.

I think I may even add a 10 minute wheel spin up on the center stand (no load on the innards), and then change the oil. Followed by 10 miles loaded, then 100 miles loaded, then 500 miles. If it looks (and sounds) ok after that, I'll ride it on out with my fingers crossed.

One thing I have considered that maybe you guys have not. I don't know the condition of this "300 mile complete" FD unit. The seller claims it was ridden about 300 miles, crashed, then sat for years. I call bs on that due to the schmutz on the outside of the case. It would be a good idea to open it up and have a look inside. Well guess what? I have to, in order to do what I'm going to do. I'll know if all those gears are good when I open it. And, I'm getting 1 brand new bearing, and at least the rest of my current bearings seem good. In the end, I could wind up better the way I'm doing it.

Then I can put my no good parts in the FD I bought, and sell it on ebay for $200, as a FD that only has 1 mile on it, was crashed and sat for years. Get all my money back.


7milesout
 

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Discussion Starter #43
We do have to give him credit for doing it himself .... he could have just put a for sale sign on it and moved it on down the road. The new buyer would have joined here and been crying about how Burgmans are a POS. 馃槂
That's what I'm going to do if my repaired FD craps out. Ha! ;)

I have the FD I bought off ebay now. Waiting on the bearing and gasket.

Does anyone know the torque of the housing cover screws?

I'm going to have to go ahead and buy a blind bearing knocker outer slide hammer. As no one around has one that they will let me borrow (not that I blame them).
 

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Or, You can put your whole aluminum gear case in your oven at 250 , take it out and the bearings should fall out for you.
Can you confirm this and would he be able to do this in his outdoor bbq grill if wrapped in foil ?
 

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Put the new bearing in the freezer for a few hours and it will most likely drop in. In one area of the last place I worked we had a sub-zero freezer for storing bearings we used where there was no way to heat the large housings they went into. If you must drive it in use maybe a large socket on the outer race with a piece of wood on top to cushion the shock of tapping. Putting a piece of towel rag between the socket and bearing helps a bit too.

As a point of interest, large bearings wrapped in burlap between two thin sheets of dry ice in a cooler is a faster way of cooling. Cooling bearings rather than heating housings is an alternative method of removing the outer furry covering of a deceased cat.
 

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As bcalan say freezer for an hour or so heat the casing even a few kettles of boiling water over the back of the casing in line where the bearing goes will do. Large G cramp place a bit of timber on the back of the casing and a suitable sized socket on the outer race and use the G cramp as a press
 

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A heated aluminum case , will certainly expand more in an oven than the steel bearing would contract in the freezer, and would be preferred,but it鈥檚 up to your wife which method you go with.
Just make sure you tap in the new bearing straight, using one of your spare diesel spark plugs.
 

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Discussion Starter #50
A heated aluminum case , will certainly expand more in an oven than the steel bearing would contract in the freezer, and would be preferred,but it鈥檚 up to your wife which method you go with.
Just make sure you tap in the new bearing straight, using one of your spare diesel spark plugs.
I think you're just biased 鈥 just look at your username!
 

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Discussion Starter #51 (Edited)
Tis a new day fellow Burgers. My Final Drive has been repaired. Talk about easy. It was so easy. A lot of labor, a little bit a frustration but not much. Did I do the right thing? Only time will tell.

A few highlights of the repair:
  • The top land of the gears I removed were worn into a blade. A spur gear teeth needs a top land, it adds a lot of strength to a gear and reduces wear (assuming properly lubricated).
  • The top land of the gears in the FD I purchased were all good. The gears themselves looked new. But the rear axle carrier was very rusted. I would have had to ran that rusted axle tube if I had just swapped FD's and not opened and exchanged parts.
  • My FD actually did NOT lose a ball bearing. I counted all 9 balls in that bearing. It looks like it chewed up a portion of a cage. It was the destruction of the teeth in chewing up of that cage that led to the rest of the wear. That's my assumption seeing that most of the wear was on the teeth of the number two gear who's bearing was the one that dropped part of a cage.
  • I cannot understand my initial (when I brought the bike home) FD oil change being so silver. Perhaps as can be noted in the pictures below, the "new" gears have a lighter gray appearance. Maybe it was that outer material wearing off that grayed the oil. It looked like that oil might have been the original oil and maintenance had never been done. It was thick, like gray toothpaste. A little runnier than toothpaste, but you get the picture.
  • I had to procure a Blind-Hole-Bearing-Puller-Slide-Hammer-Thing-A-Ma-Bob Tool. It worked great.
  • I did freeze the new bearing. To install the new bearing, I was a genius. I used the old bearing, and a flat piece of metal against the old bearing. And lined them up race-to-race and tapped it in. It went in very convincingly. It did have to be driven in, but with the freezing and the old bearing, it didn't have to be hammered, just tapped in.
  • I cleaned the housings out, but I could have done a better job (as can be discerned in the pictures below).
  • The FD oil, "really gets around." I was surprised about all the metal debris being washed out. It's not a good idea to do it this way. And it may wind up biting me in the arse. But oh well, this is how I chose to do it. If it blows up on me, then we all can learn from my mistake.
  • My 10 mile test ride, the gears were super quiet. I mentioned how loud my FD was before. I'm sure it could be heard by a passing car on the interstate even with the windows up.
  • The wheel / tire is a PITA to work out and around the plastic fender.
  • I found that the rear tire is the culprit of the low speed wobble I mention in another thread. It has a large bubble just off-center to the right. So, I'm going to pull the rear tire off again and get my CT slapped on it as soon as I can. I sure hope the CT is not much more difficult to work in and up under the rear plastic fender.
Gears 2 through 5 shown. My original gear #2 is the darker one on top. The top land on the new ones are huge compared to my worn.
Each of these gears (including the #1 gear) was swapped 1 by one. I kept my original axle carrier because the original was a lot cuter than this rusty one.
The last gear was difficult to set into place because the mounting of the gear shaft into each bearing was probably line-to-line or very close to that, and on the last one, the teeth also very gently touch. This little bit of touch was enough to tend to push the gear off-axis going into the bearing. But finally it jiggled into place.
91765


91766



This was my FD drain bucket after draining for about 30 minutes 鈥 upside down. That's probably 5 FD oil changes worth of "liquid metal."
That liquid metal was like paste, hence the reason it stuck to the bottom of the bucket even when upside down.
I cleaned that mess out of the bucket and began again, with a fresh clean bucket so I could judge the new oil changes.
91767


This is my first new FD oil change. This is 10 minutes revved to 10 mph up on the centerstand.
This is proof that the oil in the FD really "gets around." This oil looked much better because it was much more like oil, than like a metal gel.
Hopefully this is all just clean out. And is why I spun these gears with no load to start with.
91768



This is the 2nd oil change after the 10 mile ride. It is actually darker. But still very much like oil, versus a gel.
I sure hope this is all just washout. Only time will tell.
The 10 mile ride, the FD was super quiet.
91769



This is the offending cage that got out and got chewed up. What I suspect initiated the gear wear. That's the old housing gasket around it.
91771


Thanks for supporting me on this!


Special thanks to:
  • Buffalo: I did use the torque spec of 7.0 ft-lbs (85 in-lbs on my torque wrench). I started out at the center 2 screws and worked my way out in a criss-cross style tightening pattern, and snuck up on the torque spec.
  • bcalan: For the frozen bearing idea. It was used, and worked well. I didn't (need to) heat / warm the FD housing. This worked well.
 

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Congrats on getting the job done. Hope you get many miles of trouble free riding out of it.
 

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..but is the Warden happy? 馃榿
 

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Discussion Starter #55
Never! It's a part of their programming. They get what the need from you (stability, accountability and DNA), then they gobble you up like a blackwidow spider. I did provide her with the organism she requested 鈥 I won't deny her that. That's a win-win. And I would buy her a nice car, if she would be nice to me. I just paid more than double for a golf cart than I spent on her car! Hahahaha!

However, I got the 09 Toyota Matrix for less than its KBB value. Bought it from one of her female friends last year October, 78k miles, $4,000. Been having lots of (smaller) trouble with it though. A lot more trouble than we had with the 04 Toyota Corolla (had nearly 300k on that sucker). And the Corolla was a lot better driving vehicle. Felt more powerful, felt more solidly planted on the road. Anywho - I've replaced the starter, the alternator, the VSV, and replaced the spark plugs (all myself of course). Not that the spark plugs were a tough job, but it was misfiring. My youngest son came to me and said, "The Matrix, it smells like raw gas sometimes when its running, something is not right." I went and cranked it and sure enough it seemed to vibrate while idling and smelled of fuel. I have a little dongle (that's what she said) that reads the codes via BT to my smartphone. Sure enough, misfire on spark plug #3. Guess my youngest is another motorhead like me.

I hope it is another job well done in the long run. Warshing that metal out makes me nervous. The Warden use to ride (sport)bike with me when we were non-codgers. I can't seem to talk her into riding the Burgman. I think if I get her on it she will like it. But so far, she won't. Is that justification for an Assistant Warden?
 

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Never! It's a part of their programming. They get what the need from you (stability, accountability and DNA), then they gobble you up like a blackwidow spider. I did provide her with the organism she requested 鈥 I won't deny her that. That's a win-win. And I would buy her a nice car, if she would be nice to me. I just paid more than double for a golf cart than I spent on her car! Hahahaha!
馃ぃ馃ぃ馃ぃ

I hope it is another job well done in the long run. Warshing that metal out makes me nervous. The Warden use to ride (sport)bike with me when we were non-codgers. I can't seem to talk her into riding the Burgman. I think if I get her on it she will like it. But so far, she won't. Is that justification for an Assistant Warden?
NO, NO, NO....assistant warden is bad ju ju of biblical proportions! ...how about a nice oil thread instead?
 

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erm, assistant wardens can be expensive, get yer money's worth, i suggest takin applications at the Kitty Kat Klub
 
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Ask Lorena Bobbitt's husband John.
 

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Yes! Good job. Happy for you. Interesting read and awesome team effort all around
 

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erm, assistant wardens can be expensive, get yer money's worth, i suggest takin applications at the Kitty Kat Klub
... or your local animal rescue organization.
Kitty Kats know who's running things. They are.

Less yelling though, and less expensive in the long run.

Or get a pup-dawg (maybe an older pup-dawg). It's only usually about them, though.

Still less yelling, and still less expensive.
 
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