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2006 Burgman 400 - Silver - 8600 miles - and climbing !
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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
Dang that's very very nasty fluid.

Hope stuff isn't damaged lol.

I'm done with the tune ups & mechanical ✔ and now fluids filters all new.

Supposed to be leaving in 5 days and needed accessories are all ordered:

Cruise control throttle lock
LED Bulbs
50L Dry Bag
Windscreen Extension Diverter

Man the bike is PURRRRRING after my 70-75 mph cruise to Lufkin - a 60 mile to round trip.

I'm probably blowing out decade old cobwebs...this bike may never have been ridden hard as I just pushed it.

Idle is smoother & acceleration more fluid.

The new tires Shinkyo brand are stellar for handling & suspension confidence.

Like a whole new bike now !
 

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Very good input. Hmmm

The East Texas Powersports service manager I spoke to yesterday - he pointed out that nearly ALL their side by sides & UTVs are CVT equipped.

Think of the dust & nasty low speed & loaded conditions they operate in !

Quite the opposite of a modestly loaded, low to moderate dust @ highway speeds evironment our Maxi-Scoots live in.

He said their CVT filter layout is normally a fine mesh screen - probably quite stringent to keep dirt out.
Maybe their airflow needs over belt etc are less, so the more restrictive filter is perfectly fine.

Just thinking out loud here.

I wonder if upgrading to the Higher Performance Dr Pulley 21 sliders in our Variator will lengthen CVT maintenance intervals versus stock ones.

Obviously there are a ton of variables in this equation !

Cheers - David

PS: Is this the filter for the Majesty 400 CVT :

View attachment 100014
Thats certainly looks like the one my yamaha majesty 400 and tmax 500 had.
 

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2006 Burgman 400 - Silver - 8600 miles - and climbing !
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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Thats certainly looks like the one my yamaha majesty 400 and tmax 500 had.
I'm sure as I got it searching using Yamaha Majesty CVT filter.

That looks like a much more serious filtration effort than on our Burgman

I wonder why ?

Did / do you note any diff in how the CVT works on each Scooter in comparison ?

A curiosity to my engineering sense....

Somebody here was saying the Burgman has the longest Factory belt interval at 14,500 miles, so somethings working alright, in any case !
 

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Between the differences of the two Yamaha scooters and the Burgman it is kind of like comparing two different fords and a GM car with automatic transmissions. You would need a trip to Dragway 42 to see any performance difference between the 400cc Yamaha and the 400cc Burgman. The 500cc tmax was about 10-15 miles faster in cruising speed and top speed because of the stock transmissions and it all comes down to what feels best. That said, from my experiences the Burgman 400 has a smoother, zoomier feel on initial startup from a stop but the Yamahas had no-squeal no-grab no-shudder clutches and better control when making a both-feet-on-the-floor-boards U turn on a secondary two lane state highway.

Hmmm, I wonder if the clutch shoes from Yamaha would work on the Burgman . . .

TLDR:
The only important difference is how the clutches perform. The Burgman has squealing, grabby, shuddering engagement issues to deal with, the Yamahas did not.
 

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Somebody here was saying,... the Burgman has the longest Factory belt interval at 14,500 miles
:unsure: Don't think they did....What "somebody" said was...
Despite all "our" moaning, our Burgmans (400s) seem to have one of the longer belt service lives (14500 miles+) among mid range scooters - with the "as designed" engineering.
And I had a Majesty too (A 250cc). IT required a CVT rebuild at less than 10K and 2 years old, tho' that came under warranty.
Sadly, VERY little is perfect in this world.
 

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2006 Burgman 400 - Silver - 8600 miles - and climbing !
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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
Very good to know gentleman.
I've got high respect for both brands & have owned several diff Yamahas & Suzuki's.

I must say that this Burgman is really enjoying coming out of retirement.

Everything that felt weird or reluctant or grabby is now gone - she feels like elastic smooth & powerful.
That rattley sound I believe has disappeared.

My rank amateur guess is it was a formerly rogue Variator roller, now behaving after 400 miles of hard & regular use.

Today I'll try to go slow & listen for the noise or it's absence.

Yesterdays high speed run did this drivetrain some good !

In terms of reliability does the CVT present any 'road breakdown' concerns or is it mainly a 'things wear slowly out, plenty of lead time to renew' ?

TY - David
 

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2006 Burgman 400 - Silver - 8600 miles - and climbing !
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Discussion Starter · #27 ·
For example my belt seems to have no wear.
Width = 24mm
Wear out = 20.8mm per manual

Either of prior owner replaced OR ? Could still be that wide @ 8500 miles ?

Also I used Inspection mirror to see clutch faces seem to have 1.5 - 2mm of material left.

Slight blue color on bell but not bad.

RPM vs Speed are about average:
70mph = 6200 rpm.

(Would love that lower RPM Malossi / Dr Pulley upgrade @ my 1st CVT rebuild - my main riding will be 85% Hiway riding)
 

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OEM CVT is pretty sturdy and doesn’t give much trouble.
Belts don’t often fail early unless they are cheap knock-offs. However, like tyres, they don’t like sitting around doing nothing.

Visual check is useful but not a guarantee, it does add to confidence that it’s OK.

Belts can go bang, which is messy and can bend things sometimes. Plus if it goes while you’re exiting a bend/overtaking or it locks your wheel up it’s going to hurt. That sounds scarier than it’s intended to be (I suspect other, more compact units are more prone to locking up)
If it’s a named belt, in spec, flexible and visibly good - I wouldn’t think twice about taking it out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
OEM CVT is pretty sturdy and doesn’t give much trouble.
Belts don’t often fail early unless they are cheap knock-offs. However, like tyres, they don’t like sitting around doing nothing.

Visual check is useful but not a guarantee, it does add to confidence that it’s OK.

Belts can go bang, which is messy and can bend things sometimes. Plus if it goes while you’re exiting a bend/overtaking or it locks your wheel up it’s going to hurt. That sounds scarier than it’s intended to be (I suspect other, more compact units are more prone to locking up)
If it’s a named belt, in spec, flexible and visibly good - I wouldn’t think twice about taking it out.
Great that all does inspire confidence.

From that do I conclude that once CVT / belt is inspected visually & running fine most modest length road trips are done without packing a spare belt ?

I imagine there's enough other things that could sooner fail.

I've got my "Road Tire Flat Emergency Kit" all together.

I'm thinking that's got to be a prime concern area for motorcycle touring.

But maybe motorcycle tires are SO tough flats are a rarity.

Still be prepared...the cost of not is too high.
 

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2003 Suzuki Burgman 400
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I bought 2 scooters recently, an 06' Burgman 400 and an 06' Yamaha Morphous. So much deferred maintenance on both, and badly damaged body panels on the Burgman that I didn't see because I didn't lie down on the ground and look up from below. Fasteners missing, fluids in unbelievably bad condition. I have a friend who when he buys a motorcycle, he replaces whatever parts needed with stock OEM parts or better. I'm beginning to understand his thinking the more I work on these scooters. I want mine to be "right", for myself and for any future buyer. What's your time frame? This listing on Ebay says it'll ship same day and arrive as early as 8/9:


Those filters are stupidly expensive, but that's part of the deal when cleaning up an older scooter.

My Morphous' coolant fluid (no that's not oil):
View attachment 100060

My Morphous' final drive oil:
View attachment 100059
I too like the idea of making my scooter right, however, that would be cost prohibitive. I have an '03 Burgman that I bought in 2020 but am just now getting around to using seriously. There are some things that could do with some nice OEM parts, but they are just too damned expensive! Therefore I have made some improvised repairs or used modified/aftermarket parts. For instance, the front fender was cracked in several places and ready to fall off. That fender is still available, but it costs $250!!! I only paid $1000 for the bike, and I'll be damned if I'm going to put a quarter of it's purchase price into something like that! What I did do was remove the fender, cleaned it up really well on the inside, put painters tape over the cracks on the outside to hold them together, then used a fiberglass kit to bind the cracks on the inside of the fender. It worked GREAT! I cleaned it up after it cured and it's just as strong and sturdy as a new one, only cost $20 and my time. Some things just are not worth the cost when improvised repairs will work, especially for an outdated and near obsolete scooter. My goal is to keep it mechanically sound and safe, not perfect. To make it perfect would cost more than a brand new one that has a warranty. Just my 2 cents. Hope that final gear drive isn't damaged, that looks like it had water get into it.
 

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2006 Burgman 400 - Silver - 8600 miles - and climbing !
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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
Yes & Amen Brother.

Good on you for an improvised fix !

The only person you've gotta please is yourself.

I was thinking on using bedliner paint on the bellypan & L+R leg shields.

My bike was laid down by a ham fisted kid and has some scratching on R side, plus the inevitable use & wear marks.

The bedliner treatment should renew & toughen the lower parts.

Did you see the post where a guy did that ?

Was also thinking on an overall color change.

Mine is "boring silver"...no offense if yours is.

I just prefer more lively colors.

This Scoot shouldn't be hard to do cause all the pieces - most anyhow - are simply removed for painting.

Sounds like a great winter project lol !

You got a great budget deal, sounds like.

Wouldn't those final drive parts be modest cost - ? Due to that they're common wear parts ?

I've no idea I'm sure they're Suzuki OE, are they spendy ?

Cheers - David in East Texas
 

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OEM CVT is pretty sturdy and doesn’t give much trouble.
Belts don’t often fail early unless they are cheap knock-offs. However, like tyres, they don’t like sitting around doing nothing.

Visual check is useful but not a guarantee, it does add to confidence that it’s OK.

Belts can go bang, which is messy and can bend things sometimes. Plus if it goes while you’re exiting a bend/overtaking or it locks your wheel up it’s going to hurt. That sounds scarier than it’s intended to be (I suspect other, more compact units are more prone to locking up)
If it’s a named belt, in spec, flexible and visibly good - I wouldn’t think twice about taking it out.
I had belts fail on my cheap Chinese scooters which I replaced with another cheap Chinese belt, which failed rather quickly. At 70 MPH on the Interstate that 250cc scooter was screaming along when there was a BANG and a loss of power. I looked back and saw a faint pale green cloud about the size of a car, which was the color of the cords in the belt. I never had one lock up the wheel, but it did embed some cords deep into the rear pulley assembly which made road side replacement tedious.

For me it is OEM belts only.
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
Wow scary to roadside, bedside tale !

I wonder what revs were at that point ?

Did you have a Tach ?

Maybe engine & CVT we're past their limit lol.

Boy, your story has me recalling the 1970 Vespa 2 stroke Scooter we had in 1980 - I'm quite sure it was a 3 speed with a clutch on the left, you'd rotate the right handgrip to shift.

I wanna say therefore it was 3 gears / direct drive. No belt...and it was quick not sure if a 125, 150 or maybe larger.

BUT I rode a 50cc Vespa Ciao Moped then too and I think it DID have a small CVT running on left side.

Man I put like 8000 miles on that Ciao in 1.5 years of commuting to my school 15 miles each way.

My Dad almost did the same commute on the Vespa Scooter - the only Hiccup being it's penchant for breaking down 2x monthly - we lived 15 miles from the Vespa dealer on El Cajon Blvd...too far to be convenient lol.

Drove my Dad crazy it did....yet he loved the Vespas zippy performance & mpg.

Whereas the Ciao Moped NEVER broke...not once in 8000 miles....

Geat fun - old, dusty memories !

My Dad bought these Vespas to save us on high gas prices...some things never change....same reason I'm on this AN400.

It's so much fun to be back on two wheels again !
 

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Yes & Amen Brother.

Good on you for an improvised fix !

The only person you've gotta please is yourself.

I was thinking on using bedliner paint on the bellypan & L+R leg shields.

My bike was laid down by a ham fisted kid and has some scratching on R side, plus the inevitable use & wear marks.

The bedliner treatment should renew & toughen the lower parts.

Did you see the post where a guy did that ?

Was also thinking on an overall color change.

Mine is "boring silver"...no offense if yours is.

I just prefer more lively colors.

This Scoot shouldn't be hard to do cause all the pieces - most anyhow - are simply removed for painting.

Sounds like a great winter project lol !

You got a great budget deal, sounds like.

Wouldn't those final drive parts be modest cost - ? Due to that they're common wear parts ?

I've no idea I'm sure they're Suzuki OE, are they spendy ?

Cheers - David in East Texas
I've found that the belly pan is rather flexible, even on the near 20 year old scooter that I have, and that is a plus when it comes to removing it if you don't want to remove the 2 lower leg shields, so I wouldn't try to stiffen it up for myself. It's helpful to remove it in case you need to jack up the front end for wheel/shock work. But an overall color change could be good, and it's definitely a great winter project. 😁

My scoot is dark blue, not too boring, but it does have it's dings and scuffs. Nothing too serious to warrant work for my purposes, I did buy it to use and not display. Keeping my fingers crossed that I wear it out completely before needing to do any major work.

As for parts I look them up up through Suzuki, copy the part number and do search to find the best price. I'm not above getting used parts from Ebay either if it saves me a couple hundred dollars. The pillion backrest that came with the scoot was torn, a new one is about $200, so I got a used one in good condition for $40. Only thing I'm worried about is needing something that's obsolete. That could end up making me have to sell it off for parts or something of that nature if I can't improvise.

Keep the rubber side down my friend!
 

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2006 Burgman 400 - Silver - 8600 miles - and climbing !
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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
Byron awesome ideas.
Was thinking similarly.
I was wondering what the Left leg shield piece goes for used or if avail, new ?

That would seem the "most likely body piece to break", due to its frequently required removal.
 

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Yeah, that's not worth thinking about. Found one in black, it's too pricey in my opinion. here's a link, it is just over $300 with shipping.


If one of mine breaks I'll do to it what I did with the fender and just fiberglass it from the inside. Duct tape, glue, and spit to hold it all together until it no longer runs is my plan, then I'll find another. Important things like seals, O-Rings, bearings and whatnot seem to be plentiful and fairly cheap. I only have a little over 12,000 miles on my bike, so it's in decent shape to last for some time aside from some brittle plastic fasteners and a few other dry rotted bits that were easily replaced. I'm a 'function over form' type of person. 😁
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
Got it. Me too mostly.
If my Burg were cherry (as I'd like eventually, IF Honeymoon lasts), only then would I plop $300 for that crucial part.
For now mine are ok.
Just 1 tab broke upon removal due to me not being UBER careful. Wiser next time !

My two 4 wheeled rigs are both 2000 & 2002 Mercedes Wagon & SUV & it's same story basically on them:

Very solid - bulletproof drivetrain & chassis, with occasional electronic snafu hurdles & plastics S L O W L Y degrading.... keeping cosmetically decent is 65% of equation.

As I say, Life is SO much better with Cars & Bikes you maintain & know with NO car payment, than any other way - IMHO.

I've got neighbors who are SLAVES to their news cars & dealer - they act like their hoods are welded shut.

Okey dokey if they're happy living like that....in times of economic downturn they panic because those 2 New Driveway Ornaments are a financial boat anchor.

Ok, rant over ...God bless & ride safe...

David
 
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